– image care of long-time reader and very occasional contributor ‘westsidefrank’
A tip for home-owners contesting proposed new taxes: Make almost any argument you want, but do not claim that any profits that you have accrued by virtue of owning Vancouver RE are ‘Hard Earned’. This insults people who work hard, and at the same time insults anybody with a modicum of intelligence. Hundreds of thousands, sometimes millions, tax free? As Bing Thom the architect once said “I have done pretty well in my business, but I made more money from sitting on my Vancouver property than I made by working an entire lifetime. That tells you something.”
[BTW, it looks like somebody has graffitied onto that sign, under the “Angry?” question, something along the lines of: “Yeah, because I can’t afford to live in a mansion like you!”]
I’m morally opposed to all taxation but, yeah, equating a bubble to hard work is absurd.
Anyone here knows how high the property tax rate would be if BC would be like Texas or Florida (no income and sales taxes)?
I read someone claiming 2% property tax based on assessed values.
That’s not bad.
5006 Fraser St: contender for turkey of the year – even if it wasn’t on a godawful traffic street overlooking the graveyard. Blurb says “ONE OF A KIND”. That’s true. Over $2M list for this absurdity in a No Frills location.
How much would you pay for it?
I can finally be the king of my own castle…
“We’re losing money galore”.
Couldn’t have said it better myself!!!!!
Polling has consistently put taxing higher-priced properties as having strong public support. Attempts to change that have so far been unsuccessful. It’s almost as if…”the rich” can’t relate anymore to everyone else. I’m in shock
That’s mob rule.
Can’t change rules mid-game.
tax-tax-tax … have we forgotten what socialism gone full retard did last century? … oh wait, what’s this … https://tinyurl.com/y8lqcrj2
I bet 80%+ people also support taxing rich people, more successful people, or anyone but me more. 🙂
some things that cannot be left to a popularity contest … that’s why there’s a constitution or bill of rights … it’s not the if, it’s the how … rich ppl creating smthing useful, u want more … let the competent rise to the top – better for all … but criminals on top is an inverted morality – to remedy, the punishments should be xx-medieval … yes-yes-yes, not blk/white … but the pt survives … and taxes? … can’t solve either pb, instead just adds another
For those who want to gear up for next year’s election: https://www.redbubble.com/people/edgycentral/works/31319872-auto-erotic-justin-trudeau?rbs=
Satan owns this house?
3353 Scotch Pine Avenue, Coquitlam
Jun 11: $1,666,666
Change: – 522,134 -24%
better than those infernal 8’s
Satan isn’t that stupid. And he likes to walk and cycle. With a walk/bike score of 8, that’s not happening. This pile of custom crap is in the boonies – even tsunami-challenged Ditchmond is better.
The sellers paid $100K over assessed in 2016 @ $1.79M. That was incredibly stupid. Had they paid assessed, in itself a ridiculous sum, they’d be exiting with minimal loss. They should have bought it for way less. The original list was just pie in the sky silly. The nearly carbon copy custom caca construction beside it @ 3355 Scotch Pine sold in 2015 for $1.24M – half a mil less.
This was a custom caca tract house development on the side of a mountain in bear country. Google bears and Coquitlam. Put aside price. Imagine going there. It’ll take lots of time. Burn out your powertrain going up the mountain. Burn out your brakes going down. Or take the bus – if you have hours to kill.
This listing is a prime example of why charts and graphs are bullshit.
Imagine being as miserable a person as Arnie.
Nice thing about Ninja is that you can’t feel sorry for him.
Ninja – the relentlessly toxic twerking troll.
Arnie critiques second-rate properties to compensate for the regret he feels over purchasing his own second-rate property.
In a second-rate neighbourhood.
In a second-rate city.
Try adding something — anything — of public utility instead of frantically scratching your own itch.
Ninja the toxic troll – time to towel off after your hot twerk with your dog. Go look at a chart.
504 590 Nicola Street, Vancouver
Jun 11: $1,099,000
Change: – 299000.00 -21%
725 7008 River Parkway, Richmond
Jun 11: $549,000
Change: – 169000.00 -24%
1295 Duchess Avenue, West Vancouver
Jun 11: $2,800,000
Change: – 900000.00 -24%
A: $3,720,000 (WTF!!!!!)
248 N Gamma Avenue, Burnaby
Jun 11: $1,499,000
Change: – 260000.00 -15%
Ph5 6198 Ash Street, Vancouver
Jun 11: $1,380,000
Change: – 500000.00 -27%
Yikes. More to come. Much more.
If you are serious about understanding real estate values, and not being a troll, you have to stick to a segment, not a hodgepodge of condos, penthouses, West Van, Richmond, D/T, Burnaby … that you are picking off some chump’s chart. You might as well start looking at Manitoba, or Nunavut.
Nicola St: strata hell; better to rent.
A “luxury” one bed one bath for over a mil plus $543/month maintenance? That is crazy. But they are still asking over assessed. Looks like they bought the unit new and will profit when they unload it.
Sorry, I won’t fall for your fallacy of division: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_division
3088 W 35th Avenue, Vancouver
Jun 12: $4,288,000
Change: – 1200000.00 -22%
1205 2770 Sophia Street, Vancouver
Jun 12: $1,698,000
Change: – 300000.00 -15%
13070 22a Avenue, Surrey
Jun 12: $1,870,000
Change: – 318000.00 -15%
This house has hit its “Release the Kraken” moment. The decline in price comes to 500,000$/month! Drug money jumping ship?
8480 Sunnywood Drive, Richmond
Jun 12: $1,990,000
Change: – 990000.00 -33%
When you introduce sophistry and Surrey to the mix, you’ve really gone off the rails.
Here’s the #1 problem with the listings you’re picking off someone’s chump chart. The “drop” is based off a pie-in-the-sky shoot for the moon first ask.
Recalibrate based off actual assessed, or original purchase price – real numbers – and the scenario will be completely different.
Pick your best three for analysis.
Try and find something in fabulous East Van.
As I said, Arnie is now making things up as he goes. It allows him some temporary respite from his cognitive dissonance–that painful mismatch between reality and the delusion in his mind.
Watch as his definition of the “market” shrinks like a drop of water in the sun. Eventually, the delusion will no longer be sustained. Arnie will realize that no only have outlying properties cratered in price, but so too has every last square inch in “fabulous” East Van–including his own little plot of dirt and termites.
Meantime, he’s quite happy to waste everyone’s time with this nonsense.
This is Nu Stream Realty Inc. lies. They purposely under price a house by hundreds of thousands of dollars and then reject offers even 400,000 above ask. An example was a house on East 50th they were asking 1.288. Huge bidding war, the highest offer was 1.62 which the owners rejected. Anytime you see a listing by Nu Stream Realty Inc, don’t believe the hype. That being said if they do this enough times they are going to accidentally put downward pressure on their own listings. But let’s be aware of their shenanigans.
I know that was not in 2016 that was actually about 3 weeks ago.
It’s a good point thanks. It makes them look really bizarre though.
Moronic Ninja looks at s….ing or getting off the pot. Starts twerking uncontrollably. Gets relief when he trolls.
3637 Haida Dr – listed as 3627: bought as a scraper 3 years ago for $1,549,888. Asking a stratospheric $3.688M.
At this price it should have a commanding location, but it’s way down the slope. And it doesn’t back onto or face the park. A loser location with a ridiculous unpleasant “luxury” house. Awful. A ridiculous sum of money.
Was bought last year for $1,190,000:
7954 Lakefield Drive, Burnaby
Jun 13: $999,999
Change: – 489001.00 -33%
2131 166 Street, Surrey
Jun 13: $1,099,000
Change: – 181000.00 -14%
2713 Davies Avenue, Port Coquitlam
Jun 13: $945,000
Change: – 255000.00 -21%
2721 Davies Avenue, Port Coquitlam
Jun 13: $990,000
Change: – 310000.00 -24%
Scraping the bottom of the barrel in the boonies. Don’t bother looking up walk scores – you’re not walking anywhere from these places.
No sane person would call any of the above Vancouver. The Surrey address is an hour away by car and doesn’t even have google street view. Nice farmland in front until they build more repellent McMansions.
The Burnaby house faces a sound barrier in front of the Trans Can. Talk about a view. And those barriers don’t work. They mitigate, but don’t block the high-pitched noise of traffic. Not worth living here let alone buying.
Curious that the PoCo properties are side by side. Could be worth buying the two and turning them into an industrial site if zoning permits. Facing a busy road and the railroad tracks, you certainly don’t want to live here. Note that the list prices are higher than assessed – even after the “drop” – one by almost $150K.
Arnie’s head is exploding.
Footsteps, Arnie, footsteps.
Ninja the toxic troll – just can’t bear to shut his hole.
Bent over and forget Vaseline, Mr. Market is going in dry:
4650 Baldwin Street, Vancouver
Jun 14: $1,068,000
Change: – 467000.00 -30%
6318 Brooks Street, Vancouver
Jun 14: $1,998,000
Change: – 490800.00 -20%
14 7551 No 2 Road, Richmond
Jun 14: $788,000
Change: – 400000.00 -34% ( It is a New Coast listing)
1907 668 Columbia Street, New Westminster
Jun 14: $428,000
Change: – 100000.00 -19%
Baldwin sold way back in 2014 for $987K. It is now offered as half a house – yes, a dreaded duplex on a weird shaped lot flanking an alley sitting on top of a stream. Multiply the ask times two and you have way over assessed.
Brooks St is the closest to value. Bought for under $600K 15 years ago, the ask is just under median for the area. But if I had a couple of mil to throw down, I’d require south-facing and a view. I don’t need Skytrain, but tenants usually do. Then again, there is no suite, or laneway house. Buyers these days expect that.
No 2 Road Richmond is painful to contemplate. If you can stand living on a busy street in a strata unit, have at it. It was bought 3 years ago for under $600K. There’s still lots of meat on the bone for the sellers.
Columbia St – 1 bed 1 bath condo for around $400K – so what. It was bought for $290K 3 years ago. Again, it’s silly to base supposed drops on shoot for pie in the sky listing prices.
What about this?: https://thinkpol.ca/2018/06/04/vancouver-houses-sold-assessment-may/
Thinkpol – a few wankers, mostly anonymous, sloppily trying to make it in “new media” based on an ad revenue, subscription, donation model. Cash flow, unsurprisingly, is not happening.
There are no addresses here. Nothing to look up for analysis. Wasted space.
You referenced “stream” and “Skytrain”, per usual word salad, but forgot to mention “bog”.
Ninja the toxic troll got excited by the reference to vas. He’s seriously chafed by all his twerking. Bring it along to his next looking at charts party.
Also, Arnie lives here.
Very happy to live here. This city is great. Stupendous. Esp. fabulous East Van.
Losers meet at Starsucks and whine. Don’t forget to tip the barista. Asshole owner Schultz, one of the richest men in the world, doesn’t want to share his cash.
East Van is fabulous if you like treeless streets, horrendous postwar specials, high crime, and junkies.
Hey, why don’t you share some of your cash, Chile-con-Arnie? Lots of sub-Saharan Africans could use it. You’re richer to them than Schulz is to you.
What’s that? Not gonna happen? Didn’t think so.
There are better targets for your billionaire hatred. Starbucks is more progressive than most employers, which is a sad commentary on level of greed in the world we live in, and far more progressive than most food service employers.
Sticking up for a billionaire? Are you a stockholder?
Examine his bogus benefits and see if you can deduce where the bullshit is. It’s not that hard to see through the corporate p.r. propaganda. Smarmyballs Schultz knows how to lay it on.
Keep in mind that his wage slaves have beggar bowls on the counter while he has billions – and that’s just the way he likes it.
Companies try to retain customers through loyalty programs. They do the same with employees, esp. those with a high churn rate like burger joints and coffee shops. It’s cheaper than giving cash and the company benefits further from a halo effect – no different from greenwashing, pinkwashing, whitewashing … don’t know the neologism in this case.
Over the span of multiple decades, guy builds a global business from scratch. All based on *voluntary* exchanges between suppliers, customers, and employees. Nobody is forcing the baristas to work there. They do so out of their own free will.
Schulz, and the business he created, have paid more in taxes than a million Arnies combined.
Yeah, he has billions. As he should.
Are they sitting in some Dr. Evil vault? No. They have been reinvested in new ventures, helping other entrepreneurs to hire people, and bring new ideas to fruition, to the benefit of consumers.
Innovating. Working hard. Risking their future. Some will succeed; many will fail.
Arnie, meanwhile? He hammers away at his keyboard.
You jealous? Bitter? Go start a business instead of yapping childishly about others’ success.
Let me kick it off for you:
Smarmyballs Schultz ponders how to get his wage slaves to stick around – the employee churn rate is a drag on revenue. Maybe give them 10 bucks extra if they stay a whole week. No, it sounds way way better to give them a small bag of coffee.
How about that beggar bowl.? How would you like to stand on your feet 20 plus hours/week, mindlessly making coffee, hoping for some baksheesh – that you have to share with your supervisors.
Why are there beggar bowls on the counters of this greedy pig’s businesses? Do you call that progressive – or degrading.
Smarmyballs has the cash – he just doesn’t want to share.
That is contemptible greed. Vile.
Ninja the toxic troll always tips the billionaire’s wage slaves. It’s his favourite place to whine about not being able to afford a house in the best city in the world.
Working in a coffee shop is a desperate survival move, not a choice.
During the Irish Potato Famine quality foods were still being shipped to the rich in England. Over a million Irish died. Too bad Smarmyballs didn’t have Starsucks there. He would have had no trouble with wage slave retention.
Nobody is forcing anyone to work at Starbucks. It’s 100% voluntary. If you look at the average barista, they’re college students or otherwise young and unqualified for most other jobs, let alone a trade or profession. It’s a stepping stone for them; a way to make some extra cash while they acquire studies or skills. Nobody makes a career out of being a barista, although that would be a more noble pursuit than your faux-social justice.
I have met people who worked at Starbucks. There’s nothing bogus about the benefits. Imagine the people who got into the share ownership scheme in the early days, how much that stock is worth today. Arnie, you are down on over 99% of the houses for sale, anyone who has less than you, and apparently anyone who succeeds in accumulating wealth no matter if they try to treat their employees fairly, (Schultz) or give their fortune away (Buffett).
Arnie has the arrogance to think he speaks for the thousands of folks who work voluntarily at Starbucks. Guess what? They are showing their satisfaction with Schulz’s policies every time they clock in. They are voting with their feet and don’t need some keyboard social justice warrior to whine on their behalf about tip jars. Only a born-into-privilege prick could lack the empathy and social awareness to claim that baristas’ job is beneath them.
You “met people who worked at Starbucks”? When you were ordering your latte?
Did you put alms in the beggar bowl?
Here’s what workers want: cash. They know what they want to do with it. Smarmyballs Schultz is playing the game – and winning. Billions.
F… him and f… his coffee shops.
A degrading beggar bowl for the wage slaves on the counters of a multi-billionaire? Have you tried standing on your feet 20 plus hours/week – making coffee? How long would you last?
Again, it’s cheaper for him to squawk about benefits than to give real cash. His coffee shops get the halo effect, he pockets more cash. That’s what he and his wage slaves have in common. They want money. That’s why there’s a beggar bowl on every counter.
30% discount on drinks … that cost peanuts … that you make yourself … that you drink while standing and working. There’s a benefit.
The people I have met who worked at Starbucks were friends, relatives and colleagues who had moved on to a new workplace. I always tip when I have coffee in a coffee shop.
I haven’t stood on my feet 20 hours a week making coffee, but I did stand on my feet 40 hours a week working high volume retail for 28 years. I didn’t make coffee, but I moved a lot of product around, tore down and built a lot of racking, and about a million and one other things.
I don’t know too many employers that offered same sex benefits as quickly as Starbucks did, offer benefits to part time workers, and offer meaningful ownership of the company via discounted share purchase schemes. Particularly in the service sector.
The low pay at Starbucks and other companies has to do with government policies that have led to low union density, a decade of frozen minimum wages, and the war on workers that has been conducted since the eighties. There’s plenty of blame to go around, and workers wages are a reflection of that sad reality. I stand by my point that in the world of baristas, Starbucks deserves its Glassdoor rating of 4.1/5. There’s a lot of employers that would love to get that kind of rating.
Sour grapes from the relentlessly toxic troll Ninja – nothing to contribute but bile.
It’s business too. Almost 100% increase in property tax
1560 41ST AVE E, Original Price $1,385,000, Sale Price $1,200,000,
4840 VICTORIA DR, Original Price $1,438,000, Sale Price $1,350,000,
2836 16TH AVE E, Original Price $1,519,000, Sale Price $1,315,000
1214 GEORGIA ST E, Original Price $1,499,000, Sale Price $1,300,000
5869 DUMFRIES ST, Original Price $1,430,000, Sale Price $1,295,000
The 16th Ave and Georgia St ones were probably worth buying. The first has broad appeal, the second is an industrial area. I’ve cycled through both areas a thousand times. Kind of like them both for different reasons. Emotionally I prefer the 1905 built house in the industrial area, but when you start looking at things like foundation work, or roof replacement on something this old (and tall) you better know what you’re doing – and have a big reserve fund – not for the faint of heart. The others are on garbage streets, or a scraper on a bog – and they didn’t sell for under assessed.
The Georgia St house – 6 bedrooms – 1 bathroom. Imagine that. Hasn’t been for sale forever. Pretty interesting to historical buffs.
Another source gives the number of bedrooms as 8 and bathrooms as 3. In 113 years, there’s been a lot of monkeying around with it without the bother of permits.
The owner of 2836 16th died last year at the age of 92. Definitely not a flip.
4855 Smith Avenue, Burnaby
Jun 16: $1,999,000
Change: – 591000.00 -23%
2 1296 Salsbury Drive, Vancouver
Jun 16: $988,000
Change: – 311900.00 -24%
427 W 14th Street, North Vancouver
Jun 16: $2,098,000
Change: – 390800.00 -16%
These are massive price reductions over very short periods. Try annualizing these. That’s how we get to -75% peak to trough.
Smith: bought last year for $1.8M. If they can shift this crap location for within $100K of ask they’re lucky. And why did the value of this 1911 old timer drop from $51K to $11K? Fire? Flood?
#2 unit Salsbury – strata ugh – bought for under $500K 6 years ago. Listed over assessed. 834 sq ft stacked on 3 floors means 600 sq ft of usable space – the rest is stairs – claustrophobic up down up down up down – developing your butt muscles – good for a twerker.
N. V. – wouldn’t buy it even for the $1.25M they paid 8 years ago.
Also, Arnie lives here.
And Ninja, you toxic troll, my dad was a milkman his whole life. I grew up in the sticks. My family never went to a restaurant together in our entire lives. Not once. Not even to a coffee shop.
You’re the one who grew up in privilege, but your parents pissed it away. Which is why you are such a bitter toxic mouthy weasel.
Well, Arnie, if you’ve never been to a restaurant or coffee shop, it’s no wonder you’re ignorant. No wonder you spit on the staff as “beggars” for relying on tips as part of their livelihood.
Your arrogance is breathtaking.
By the way, it ain’t just Starbucks. There isn’t a restaurant in the world where the employees aren’t happy to receive tips in exchange for good service.
I left home at age 15 and got the first of many jobs in restaurants, from a coffee shop in Montreal, to fine dining in three cities in Canada – including here. I know the business intimately – front and back of the house.
There are countries where the concept of tipping is alien, or unnecessary, like Japan and Australia. A worker chased me down in Cairo to return a tiny sum I had left.
In New York, Danny Meyer has abolished tipping in his supremely successful restaurants.
I speak not of them but of a multi-billionaire who thinks it’s okay for adults to have a beggar’s bowl on the counter. Again, he has the cash – so much cash that cannot ever spend it all. But he won’t share with his wage slaves. He’d rather introduce stupid new beverages and squawk about perks. Horse poo. The workers want cash. Ask them.
In a lot countries where restaurant tipping isn’t the custom, there’s a “service charge” built in to the bill (and even then, workers will rarely turn down the offer of an extra reward). This goes for restaurants, but also pretty much every other service-based industry.
Which system is better at incentivizing exceptional service? The answer is obvious.
Not only does it incentivize better service, it helps businesses to attract and retain the most motivated workers, and drop the least productive ones. Owners alone can’t monitor their employees so closely as to finely discern the better performers from the grumps. Better to recruit the assistance of the customer in that filtration process.
It’s not begging. Beggars offer no service. To call voluntary workers beggars is to reveal your disdain for their personal choices.
Wait staff earn a significant part of their livelihood from tips. Not only that, what is dignifying? A handout from the CEO, given not according to merit but to some feel-good, forced redistribution? Or a direct cash payment following good service? My lazy, tardy, grumpy coworker gets the same as me? No thanks. I’d rather be recognized for my work.
Like any CEO, Schulz is accountable to his shareholders, and his shareholders alone. Their interests are his sole responsibility. Let me repeat, he is responsible to NO ONE else other than his shareholders.
And therein lies the beauty of free-market capitalism. Businesses cannot fulfill their responsibilities to shareholders *without* treating their employees satisfactorily. If they don’t, employees will defect to competitors, morale will drop, customer service will suffer, turnover will rise, etc. etc. These are real, hard-dollar costs that a business cannot sustain if it is to survive and thrive.
This simple concept is of course lost on socialists, social justice warriors, and other malcontents who lack a basic understanding of economics and human behavior.
Free-market capitalism? You are naive.
“This simple concept is of course lost on socialists, social justice warriors, and other malcontents who lack a basic understanding of economics and human behavior.”
As illustrated by Arnie.
It’s too bad people are so gullible, but that explains how a complete psycho like Madoff got away with billions. For decades.
Just assume that everything Smarmyballs Schultz says is bullshit – and work back from there. Figure out the angle.
Btw, I was 100% off on the cost of the bag of coffee Smarmyballs allows his wage slaves to have in lieu of giving real hard cash. I pay $8.75 retail for a pound of free trade organic. Smarmyballs gets it wholesale, so it’s closer to $5.00.
And the Glass Door rating of SMUX is barely above average. When you consider that the wage slaves are on the young side, and that supervisors are posting, and who knows what devious devices SMUX uses to tilt the ratings, don’t give much weight to this number. Of course, compared to suffering at a shithole like Rotten Ronnies, it’s better. Be like buddha and use your eyes – see the beggar bowl – see the multi-billionaire.
Ninja is a big fan of eugenics and robotics. “Two wheels of the same cart!” he chirps.
Don’t forget to tell your landlord to tip the plumber the next time he comes to fix your toilet.
2244 Austin Avenue, Coquitlam
Jun 18: $1,299,900
Change: – 299900.00 -19%
350 N Hythe Avenue, Burnaby
Jun 18: $1,699,000
Change: – 481000.00 -22%
7460 Aubrey Street, Burnaby
Jun 18: $1,588,000
Change: – 391000.00 -20%
2957 W 23rd Avenue, Vancouver
Jun 18: $1,888,000
Change: – 600000.00 -24%
1506-9603 Manchester Drive, Burnaby
Jun 18: $599,000
Change: – 120000.00 -17%
You persist in posting drops from ask – stick with assessed and previous sold price – real numbers.
Austin – a semicustom house on a big lot on a nasty high traffic street – a waste of money. Period.
Says the guy who equates ask prices with sold prices!
Hythe – check the walk score; check the roof; check the crazy topography. Bought 3 years ago for $1.6M. Builder’s special. Worth buying if you can afford to build new. No lane. Tons of driveway.
Aubrey – great spot if you’re a mountain goat – check the walk score. Ask is now almost exactly at assessed. So?
W 23rd – out of a cesspool of listings comes a feeding frenzy price on a property that ticks almost all the right buttons. Nobody’s getting this house for this price.
Condo on Manchester – a “drop” in the assessed from $604K to an ask of $599K? That’s it? Bought new 20 years ago for $200K.
More like proximity-to-psycho-neighbors score.
This had to be said.
Poor Ninja – nothing to contribute – so he twerks and chirps.
Keyboard warrior yaps constantly about ‘twerking’.
I don’t even know what twerking is.
And I refuse to look it up.
This had to be said.
Big excitement in Ninja’s world – he’s been nominated to the Twerk and Troll Hall of Fame.
808 14th Ave: 111-year-old viewless nothing, bought 2.8 years ago for $1.2M. Low-grade reno and staging. The usual beige sheepskin throw is black; so are the pillows. That’s just plain weird. Assessment says 1,650 sq ft. Ad says 2,174 sq ft. Listed at $1,899,999. Totally Ridiculous.
3325 Douglas Road, Burnaby
Jun 19: $799,000
Change: – 189000.00 -19%
2205 Bonaccord Drive, Vancouver
Jun 19: $2,380,000
Change: – 510000.00 -18%
6440 Claytonwood Grove, Surrey
Jun 19: $948,000
Change: – 170000.00 -15%
2007 W 29th Avenue, Vancouver
Jun 20: $7,980,000
Change: – 1700000.00 -18%
4503 Marine Drive, West Vancouver
Jun 20: $2,499,999
Change: – 499001.00 -17%
Douglas Road – half a house on a hideous street – 3.9% under assessed. Not worth it.
Bonaccord – a monstrosity of a house – an exemplar of what not to build. A pretentious embarrassment. A repellent house on an inferior site. The 1.4% drop from assessed does not begin to atone for this ridiculous semicustom. Awful.
Claytonwood – a snout house in the wilds of Surrey. Sold for $663K 2.9 years ago. Commuter hell and cul de sac claustrophobia. Shudder.
W 29th – list is still over assessed. The land was bought in 2014 for $3.9M.
Marine Drive West Van – a crazy busy street leading to the misery of the two bridges. Some of the worst times of my life were spent commuting to the North Shore. The drop is only 4% off assessed. Peanuts. Bought for $1.3M in 2013. It’s still listed in the stratosphere – a $1.2M bump in just 5 years. Lunacy.
Arnie frantically scrambling to Google every one of the now dozens of price drops that Sebastien has posted, so that he may dismiss them on some basis (any basis) and not confront the pain of reality.
Predictable, yes. But more than anything, sad.
Ninja the toxic troll – always ready to spew.
Sebastien is part of an online tribe of people who post properties with ridiculous asking prices, where listing agents are playing some kind of nonsense ego game with clients in order to get listings. Filtering out the crazy asking prices would make a better case.
SFH homes are selling below assessed value in increasing numbers. There are still some going for assessed and above, in declining numbers. The market is off about 17% from the peak. Not the crash people are looking for, yet. Condo’s are still at a manic level of increase year over year, and townhouses are routinely priced at a thousand a square foot, and up.
The taxation and mortgage rules have hit the SFH market hard, but it’s not a knockout blow yet. We are still a long way from any definition of affordability. Will townhouses and condos follow suit? Stay tuned.
It’s against one’s interest to list high, and then drop price. A few fools might do that, but not so many as Sebastien has posted. Fact is, asking prices are dropping, not because of some “ego game”, but because buyers have evaporated.
This is the just the beginning, the very beginning, of a multiyear meltdown. SFHs are the first to crumble, because they rose first and highest. They will continue to decline in price until, on average, they are down about 65% from peak. That would price them roughly in line with fundamentals.
Apartments and townhouses will follow suit.
The bursting of the bubble will have huge socioeconomic repercussions, which have been discussed here at length. One effect that no one has addressed, though, is that this is going to actually cost lives. I posted a while back about the coming suicides, murders, riots, drunk driving accidents, etc. that will result from the economic Hiroshima that will hit Vancouver and Canada more broadly. This is going to be a multi generational tragedy the likes of which we have never seen.
The “socioeconomic repercussions” are going to be limited to you and your twerking dog! Har har — I just kill myself sometimes.
Good one … too bad Ninja the Doomsday Prepper doesn’t know what twerking is.
… market 17% off from peak. What does that mean exactly?
Arnie, who suffers from low testosterone, can’t even throw a decent “keyboard” punch.
According to Steve Saretsky, Vancouver detached was down 12.5% in a year.
MLS benchmark says benchmark prices are down 1.5%. That’s because the usual floaters in the market aren’t selling for inflated prices.
Mama’s boy Saretsky has one crap listing on Canada Way for $399K. An embarrassment. No wonder he’s such a doom and gloomer. If he hustled for listings, maybe some assemblies, instead of flapping his lips and playing with charts, he’d be doing a lot better. Where is the punditry of the successful agents? Not here.
2133 Upland Drive, Vancouver
Jun 21: $1,350,000
Change: – 225000.00 -14%
6820 Gainsborough Drive, Richmond
Mar 1:$3,588,000 🙂
Jun 21: $2,388,000
Change: – 1200000.00 -33%
324 Mont royal Boulevard, North Vancouver
Jun 21: $1,998,000
Change: – 381000.00 -16%
111 319 E 7th Avenue, Vancouver
Jun 21: $599,900
Change: – 80100.00 -12%
Upland: 9.4 off assessed – much good, but there are public tennis courts in back. Crazy-making.
Gainsborough: 1.55% under assessed. Whoopee.
Mont Royal: 4.1% under assessed. Get in a wheelchair and head downhill. You’ll hit 100 km/hr quickly. Car dependent.
7th Ave: I had acquaintances that managed an identical 3 storey walk-up a couple of blocks away – of which there are a multitude around here. The area is improving, but it has been pretty skanky. See Kingsgate Mall. The ground floor condo will be perpetually sunless. Scintillating views of more 3-storey walk-ups. Nice that the fascists, aka strata council, do not permit dogs. Living here would be depressing.
When you see a “man” yapping about the views at this address and that.
Understand that you are not seeing a man.
Keyboard warrior Arnie mocks and dismisses the views of all who don’t conform to his delusional narrative. From banks, to research firms, to little ol’ Saretsky, everyone is a fraud.
But the real estate cartel? They’re rock solid.
Who in their right mind trusts MLS data? Do you trust the tobacco companies for data on smoking?
Speaking of toxic trolls who like to yap and look at charts … nothing to contribute from Doomsday Prepper Ninja.
IMO, Arnie has a neurological disorder. His amygdala is wired to have more hatred towards RE bears than money launderers, astronauts families & shady realtors.
The clinical terms are OCD and sociopathy.
you’ll know how bad by the silence … when the bubble blew down here, there wasn’t much talk … contrast the constant barking and excitement during the euphoria, prices dumped very quietly
4971 Cabot Drive, Richmond
Jun 22: $2,880,000
Change: – 608000.00 -17%
It’s silly to post drops from shoot-for-the-moon first ask – silly and deceptive. Out of the smorgasbord of awful listings you’ve thrown up to date, I would have considered buying just one – where the guy died at age 92. That was a great spot for a great price – not top 1%, but very good.
I analyze real properties and real numbers – not opinionated nonsense.
Cabot Dr: I’ve actually been in ridiculous McMansions like this one. The new ask is down 4% from assessed.
The price per sq ft of land here is only $219. You’re not getting Vancouver land for that.
It was bought 2.9 years ago for $2.28M. The new list price is exactly $600K more – a ludicrous jump for a property I’d never even consider – can’t stand the sight of it – inside or out.
Good luck finding something good. And see if you can restrain yourself from posting first pie-in-the-sky asking prices – those are not real numbers.
Arnie makes judgements on the worth of select properties, while dismissing information on other properties and the broader market.
One must ask: on what basis are those judgements made, if not in the context of the broader market? How can you gauge value if you don’t take into account comparable sales, rental rates, income and economic metrics? In other words, the data, charts, and analyses that Arnie so dreads? Seriously, how do you judge value in isolation.
Arnie references assessed prices only. But they themselves are arrived at using comparables–including McMansions and other properties that he would deem undesirable / irrelevant. And of course, assessed prices are totally meaningless anyway, based as they are on recent price action and not long-term fundamental value.
I’ve been giving Arnie a hard time lately. In reality I’m not concerned with Arnie the individual. I’m responding to his posts because they are representative of a mindset that prevails among a large number of Vancouverites, and which therefore merits discussion. “Arnie” exists in the abstract.
This mindset is characterized by:
– Cognitive bias and selective reasoning
– A dismissal of history and data — skeptics as bitter (“sour grapes”)
– A sort of aggressive, anti-civic attitude toward the community and certain people
– The notion that asking prices reflect value
– Vancouver as the BPOE
– East Vancouver as attractive
“Arnie’s” worldview is not definitive in Vancouver; it is but one variation to be found in this strange village by the sea. There are other common delusions that he does not seem to display, at least publicly, like “interest rates will never go up”, and “Vancouver is economically vibrant”, etc. Likewise, his sociopathy is not common.
Overall, though, a symbol of the times.
I’m doing Sebastian the courtesy of analyzing properties that he chooses, even the ones with fake first asks.
I always look at the previous sold price – a real number.
I look at % changes in sale prices in Realtylink – real numbers broken down by neighbourhood.
I look at how long a property has been held; how many times it has been sold and resold.
I consider orientation, proximity, topography, and speculative value.
Find real addresses. Hello – real addresses – not chump charts. There’s your challenge. The rest is bs.
What someone paid for an asset in the past doesn’t give you the complete picture. Places in Palo Alto, to name but one example out of millions, have at times gone for 60% what they were going for just a few short months or years earlier. And guess what? When Vancouver prices have dropped 65% from peak, those prices won’t be predictive either. Because in all likelihood they’ll bounce back in time. Markets move in cycles.
You are an utter fool if you think that past prices are predictive of future ones. These are Arnie’s “real”, aka bullsh*t numbers.
Ninja the toxic troll – totally sour grapes – likes chump charts, esp. by experts from afar – hates the greatest city in the world – likes to twerk with his dog and poop tweet.
“Greatest city in the world”. Lol.
The bulls aren’t even trying anymore.
Ninja the toxic troll – referencing Palo Alto – whaaaat?
Posts like a dog that vomits and licks it back up.
Palo Alto = superior to Vancouver.
But fine. You don’t like the example. There are millions of others. Look no further than Vancouver. The place has gone up and down for decades. If you looked at recent prices as the basis for valuation, you would have been wrong many times.
Lesson lost on low-testosterone, low-IQ Arnie.
Ninja can’t supply real addresses in Vancouver – just attitude.
Vomit. Lap it up. Twerk with the dog. Vomit. Lap it up.
Can’t handle a genuine challenge.
2696 52nd: a hot potato – flip flip flip – hopeful lipstick renoflip to a rich fool.
Apr. 30, 2015 – $1.17M
May 18, 2015 – $1.345M
Jan 5, 2016 – $1.53M
Mar 3, 2016 – $1.795M
Listed now @ $1.988M
A ludicrous ask for a 62-year-old post war $34K scraper box flanking a street and sitting on a stream. Horrendous, absolutely horrendous kitchen layouts – both of them – check the location of the fridge in the upstairs; terrible location of the stoves; astroturf on the deck.
Ghost in the front carrying a box on google maps.
Buy a house. Get a free pizza.
Shows you the intellect of anyone buying property in today’s market.
Interesting statistics from Redfin:
By mid-2014 Greedy Guts Gates had enough cash to buy every home in Boston – houses, condos, townhouses – everything.
The parasite Waltons could buy Seattle.
The oppressive Koch’s could buy Atlanta.
As I stated before, if greedy pig billionaires got it into their heads to buy, just as a lark – not everything, but every detached house on a quiet street, they could. The biblically greedy Thomsons, who love having their lackey Grope & Flail reporters point fingers and scream Yellow Peril, could buy Vancouver.
This is your dumbest post yet. And that really says something.
Is this really what the bull argument has come to? That maybe, “on a lark”, some random billionaire will suddenly feel the urge to buy up a bunch of houses where you happen to live, and thus temporarily delay the inevitable slide in prices? That someone who got rich, and has stayed rich, by NOT spending their capital on ridiculous whims, will magically change strategy to the benefit of a few of the world’s “Arnies”?
How sad that you have to dream up such fantasies just to feel better about your doomed investment.
Where would billionaires be without the adulation of butt sniffers like Ninja.
“The greatest city in the world”
“The greatest city in the world”
“The greatest city in the world”
Bears always make fun of bulls who stretch to the max to buy into a house, forgoing pleasures like eating out, going to games, buying fancy cloth, travel, and be slave to the house doing yard work, repairs, working 2 jobs, etc. Yet, when housing prices went up, they got price out, they suddenly make fun of the concept of “hard earned home equity” as if home equity just magically appeared out of thin air while the homeowner was simply being a lazy ass fat cat who sat on a lounge chair all day, sipping martinis, and never made any sacrifices.
Well, boohoo…if you think that kind of attitude is going to get bears any friends or sympathies from homeowners, tough luck. If bears didn’t want to do the sacrifice and risk to buy a home then don’t be jealous and bitch when homeowner got ahead. Remember all those big talk about delayed gratification and all? A lot of homeowners did scrimp and save and sacrificed, even if they bought their homes for under $100K 45+ years back when mortgage rates are 15%+ and wages are like $30K and women didn’t really work.
Yes, right now it’s easy to target rich homeowners owning $3M+ houses by pitting all the homeless and those owning homes under $1.5M. Classic divide and conquer. But that situation wouldn’t last long when housing bursts and NDP can’t collect nearly enough $$ from the $3M+ and have to drop the threshold to $2M and then $1M, etc. Not to mention the change in attitude among even those under $1.5M homeowners are they see their home equity evaporate while bears are cheering and partying on.
Ah, the noble homeowner. That exemplar of financial savvy and personal sacrifice. Hear hear!
Ninja the toxic troll – thinks it’s great when one greedy pig has billions, but not ok for decent hard-working people with kids to own a house. Ridiculous.
Didn’t say it wasn’t okay to own a house. I said don’t put all homeowners up on a pedestal.
There are plenty of decent homeowners. But I object to making them some sort of martyred class. A lot of buyers in recent years have represented the antithesis of financial responsibility and sacrifice.
Like any group, it’s a mix. You have decent hard-working people. And you have speculators and fraudsters and money launderers and drug traffickers.
And whiny bitches like Arnie.
1910 28th Street, West Vancouver
Jun 25: $3,498,000
Change: – 870000.00 -20%
4852 Woodglen Court, Burnaby
Jun 25: $1,425,000
Change: – 274000.00 -16%
2149 W 35th Avenue, Vancouver
Jun 25: $4,188,000
Change: – 1000000.00 -19%
3215 Marine Drive, West Vancouver
Jun 25: $2,299,000
Change: – 381000.00 -14%
A: $2,655,000 (Note that the house didn’t sell @ Assessment 🙂 )
9620 Bates Road, Richmond
Jun 25: $1,598,000
Change: – 270800.00 -14%
A: $2,031,200 (Nu Stream ? )
2663 Wildwood Drive, Langley
Jun 25: $699,000
Change: – 230000.00 -25%
4685 W 6th Avenue, Vancouver
Jun 25: $3,988,000
Change: – 610000.00 -13%
A: $4,555,000 ( House didn’t sell close to Assessment 🙂 )
You really have to stop posting drops from a fake first ask.
The Woodglen one is interesting because the ask is less than assessed.
It is not a flip. The long-term owners are dead dead dead. The house looks like that’s where they died. It looks like it smells bad.
It has the weirdest attempt at staging, including the saddest kitchen table ever. Big stuffed dead people’s couches everywhere; a mauve toilet; depressing panelling. This is a builder’s special. They’ll scrape it and put in a house with a suite.
It is in a cul de sac, from the French ‘bottom of the bag’, aka dead-end – an inauspicious location.
The heirs just want to flog the thing and put it out of their minds.
Location on a cul de sac: for a residential property, one of the most value-enhancing attributes it can possess.
No through traffic. Less noise. Safer for kids.
Weird that this needs to be pointed out.
Wildwood – a coffin-shaped lot backing onto heavy truck taffic 200 St – nice.
The “running out of land” argument.
Ninja the toxic troll – like a bloodhound when it comes to billionaires. Gets his nose right up their a**holes and starts to twerk.
Stay classy, Arnie.
Arnie scrambling to dismiss Sebastien’s posts on any basis — any basis at all — within literally minutes of their publication.
The reality of price drops is too painful. They must be discounted however possible to preserve the Vancouver homeowner’s comfortable delusional state.
Delaying the hangover by drinking more.
Ninja the toxic troll – knows nothing about how to evaluate real estate – which is why he rents a basement with his twerky dog.
Back to the topic. Tom Davidoff on why higher property taxes are good policy.
Not-for-profit means just the interviewer gets paid.
Supported by PlaceSpeak, aka the Knob of Toads, who will charge you a fortune for listening to them croak.
Also supported by Odlum Brown, who want to sell you insurance and financial services – which you wouldn’t be able to afford if you bought a house.
And supported by Beedie – developers.
Always get a kick out of listening to Davidoff – nice voice, but he always reminds me of Gollum.
The one question the interviewer could have asked mr. assistant prof is his own housing situation. I recall reading some time back that he sold his sfd in N.V. just before the big run-up. That’s a life-changing event that his wife would bug him about forever.
Imagine being gay and married to a woman who would torment you over a piece of dirt.
No wonder Arnie is so angry.
Ninja the toxic troll – too pathetic to be pitiable. Had himself a hot twerk with his dog in his basement rental – and here he is – full of bile, as usual. Useless.
6607 Cypress Street, Vancouver
Jun 26: $4,200,000
Change: – 790000.00 -16%
1555 Fulton Avenue, West Vancouver
Jun 26: $1,888,000
Change: – 490800.00 -21%
208 1330 Genest Way, Coquitlam
Jun 26: $499,999
Change: – 88001.00 -15%
4969 Kadota Drive, Delta
Jun 26: $988,000
Change: – 210000.00 -18%
4101 Burkehill Road, West Vancouver
Jun 26: $2,399,000
Change: – 451000.00 -16%
351 Beachview Drive, North Vancouver
Jun 26: $2,075,000
Change: – 300000.00 -13%
3932 Moscrop Street, Burnaby
Jun 26: $1,799,888
Change: – 389112.00 -18%
Reformat this pile without the fake asks, and pick your best three.
2559 19th – a veritable museum of kitsch – some of that stuff could have collector appeal.
Very good location and client – very old, or dead.
Good house; could last another lifetime – unless a builder gets his hands on it.
Ask yourself what is more likely:
That dozens upon dozens of independent, self-interested, profit-maximizing sellers and agents would deliberately shoot themselves in the foot by over-inflating their ask price?
Or that keyboard warrior Arnie — a data-averse homeowner and enthusiastic RE cheerleader — is incorrect in proclaiming the asks as fake, and that in fact sellers’ hands have been forced?
It’s official, Arnie is autistic.
I was courteous and humoured you with your dishonest posts. You and Ninja are clearly trolls of a feather, if not one and the same.
You’re wrong again.
i’m not ndp but they sure got this right … https://tinyurl.com/y9xg5975
Drug money? Fraud? I thought it was because it’s the Best Place on Earth.
Oh wait, Vancouver has always been a schemey boom and bust town. From the gold rush days, to penny stocks, to today’s real estate disaster, a ‘get rich quick’ culture and lax oversight are nothing new.
What happened to the gold rush? A very small handful got rich, the rest went bust. A total waste of time and effort.
Penny stocks? Evaporated. Stock exchange moved.
And real estate, the mother of them all? It will suffer the same fate.
3468 Ontario – assessed $2.402M – listed at $3.988M. Ai caramba.
1275 24th Ave : bought 2016 for $1.56M; tarted up; assessed for $1.569M. This “STRAIGHT OUT OF A DESIGNER MAGAZINE” is sitting and sitting – listed at $2.198M – a ludicrous ask.
And when the price drops and drops – bonehead bears will flap their lips and point. Lookee lookee lookee, prices are dropping.
must have seen this by now … https://tinyurl.com/yd92huby
[Vancouver Sun] – Douglas Todd: Author of Crazy Rich Asians knows what’s fuelling Vancouver
…”The author of the best-selling debut novel, Crazy Rich Asians, which is coming out as a movie in August, knows Metro Vancouver well.
Kevin Kwan, whose trio of books satirize Asia’s most privileged people, not only knows Metro because the city is a major magnet for ethnic Chinese capital and people. He also understands the city because his parents were among the first trans-national migrants to buy one of its luxury properties.
Kwan, 44, has been visiting Vancouver since the 1980s, when extended family members and eventually his Singapore parents bought a “beautiful condo” on Robson Street, which they would visit once or twice a year. Kwan knows many graduates of the University of B.C., which his book says is also known as “The University of a Billion Chinese.”
The Hong Kong characters in his books, like Eddie, recognize the value of a Canadian passport, which Crazy Rich Asians says gives them “a safe haven in case the powers that be in Beijing ever pulled a Tiananmen again.” When Eddie is not counting his Porsches and yachts, Eddie is heading to his “holiday condo in Whistler, British Columbia, the only place to be seen skiing, since there was semi-decent Cantonese food an hour away in Vancouver.”
An expert on the “gateway” cities of the Asian elite, Kwan details the lifestyles of those shifting awesome wealth into Sydney, San Francisco, Hong Kong, New York, Toronto and Vancouver. “I’ve observed the phenomenon for the past 30 years. At first it was lapping waters. Now it’s like a tidal wave,” he said with a laugh during an interview. On a recent book tour visit to Vancouver, his first in almost a decade, he noticed “how much things continue to change: The influx of Asians everywhere is quite remarkable.”…
Cohodes speaks truth:
I told you this real estate bubble was deadly. Fentanyl is another scythe in its hands.
Societal dislocation a side effect of the housing bubble.
Arnie, on-cue, 3-2-1:
“Let ’em leave. We don’t need people! (Okay, maybe some rich Asians to keep this train chugging). And if those snot-nosed millennials want to stay, they should just shut up and scrimp and never eat at a restaurant for their entire lives!”
Forget brain drain. Let’s have a bull drain.
“Greatest city in the world”
Sign of the top…
How infantilizing is this? They are literally using Disney fonts, “prizes”, and a “bouncy castle” to entice buyers.
And how lame do you have to be if this actually entices you to spend your weekend with strangers, elbowing each other over four walls and a roof, destined to lose value?
4731 Cedarcrest: a dreadful house in a dreadful location – bought as a West Van scraper just over a year-and-a-half ago for $1.65M – new-build listed at $3.498M
Small lot for the area, weird shape, largely unusable because of the extreme slope.
Horrible layout. Gargantuan fridge that will rattle your brain throughout the echo chamber live-cook-eat space. Brutal sharp-edged island counter that will break a child’s head.
Sad laundry area – not even pedestals in this little space.
Moronic wide-opening patio doors that will allow swarms of insect life in, as well as the occasional bear. Really really stupid.
So car dependent.
Note, you can test drive the X and the S, but if you buy this godawful property, you’re getting the 3.
But it doesn’t matter what you drive when you face the living hell of the North Shore Bridges. Living hell.
Dismiss all signs of market weakness on some random basis (“insects”, “bears”, “large fridge”… whatever) to preserve comfortable mental state. Wash. Rinse. Repeat.
Indeed. Why do we have to suffer those “bridge and tunnel people”?
On the plus side, no bogs.
Ninja the Toxic Troll has a knack for consistently sounding like an idiot.
Where was Sherlock Cohodes when Bernie Madoff perpetrated the biggest fraud in the history of the world – over a period of decades?
Clueless Cohodes. Likes to point his finger at the Chinese.
Hello, Mr Yellow Fever.
Clueless Cohodes the Chicken Farmer.
Why doesn’t this American stick with sleuthing in his own country’s cesspool?
“Where was Sherlock Cohodes when Bernie Madoff…”
Because one individual didn’t expose every fraud ever perpetrated, his exposure of the Vancouver RE fraud is illegitimate. Very logical.
“Biggest fraud in the history of the world”
The biggest fraud in the history of the word is not Madoff. It is central banking.
And watch as the losses from the Canadian real estate bubble dwarf those from Madoff.
“Why doesn’t this American (“chicken farmer”) stick with sleuthing in his own country’s cesspool?”
Shooting the messenger is not an argument.
Xenophobe Arnie is upset because Cohodes is smarter and more successful than him. Resorts to mockery to feel better about himself. A deeply unattractive character flaw that should have been corrected in childhood.
Nobody was able to call Madoff because it wasn’t a public company. You knew that, right?
There there, Ninja, the Toxic Troll, go have yourself a nice twerk and settle down.
Arnie worried that when his house drops 65% in value, he will have to go back to work at Starbucks, enriching Schulz while cheerfully serving millennials in the hope of a few cents in tips.
It’s beyond that. For people like Arnie, RE is a religion. He sees bears as reprobates or demon-possessed. Realtors are priests and rising homes values is a blessing from God.
F*ck cyclists. And I say that as I cyclist. Bicycles do not belong on roads.
i’ve be riding my whole life … bikes definitely should be on the road … but bike lanes, at least the present incarnation of the public virtue signalling variety, are the worst thing ever … take the unused rail lines and turn them into quality gravel roads, works fine for commuters and general use, keeps away the speeder roadies … for the rest, take a few unbroken minor streets where you don’t want arterial traffic anyway and dedicate full road priority to bikes, motorists will just avoid … leave the rest alone, especially any main artery
We need dedicated bike paths and I like your rail line conversion idea. Gravel roads would perfect — as you say, would keep out the speeder roadies. My issue is with their aggressiveness. Quite content to occupy most if not all of a car lane, then throw a spaz if cars get too close. They’re a hazard to themselves and to drivers.
Canada’s (American) Clueless Crusader Cohodes.
Not a peep about Madoff
Not a peep about the 2008 financial meltdown.
Racist peeps about Chinese.
Why is this American sticking his beak into Canada?
Nothing going on in California?
Hundreds (thousands?) of foreigners in Vancouver evade taxes, abuse public services, launder money, and commit fraud… and you are totally silent.
One man, Cohodes, expresses his view that Vancouver’s real estate market is unhealthy, and you’re crying like a little bitch.
Just because East Vancouver is the center of your world doesn’t mean everyone else is so provincial. Some people have broader horizons. Cohodes has uncovered fraud outside the U.S. before (e.g. Europe’s NovaStar Financial). The fact that he has commented on Vancouver shouldn’t surprise you.
Why don’t you man up and admit there’s a problem in your little village by the sea, instead of shooting the messenger.
Wrong . Cohodes called New Century in 2007.
Is that why his hedge fund went out of business in 2008?
Angry Arnie jealous / scare of multi-millionaire Cohodes. Sad!
cohodes fund was positioned for a big gain in 2008-9, got screwed by gs
Was Coho all grown up when he decided to play with the bad boys at Goldman?
He got hooked. He got spanked.
And he retired. Forever. But he didn’t.
Now he’s sticking his nose into Canadian affairs.
Because he’s like a shining white knight in a cape – the Clueless Crusader.
His emblem is a giant pointing finger. He’s good at pointing his finger at all the evil-doers.
The curious thing is his self-proclaimed friendship with Eby. If the reporter had any instinct, they would have asked about that.
Arnie fine with thousands of Asian money launderers, tax evaders, and fraudsters, but the dissenting views of one American are too scary.
arnie … guys like that, almost inconsequential what they’ve won/lost … they KNOW how to make all they will need … got other reasons for working and living … besides, why so hot on someone for pointing out the obvious – that there’s something very rotten with van re
Ninja the Toxic Troll – intellectually bankrupt.
Summer 2018 Vancouver = Summer 2007 Miami 😃😃😃😃
I told you the bubble’s bursting would lead to violence:
Coming soon to a city near you…
3344 28th Ave E: renoflipping beavers at work applying lipstick and appliances. Most of the listed repairs and maintenance like the roof, water tank and windows were done before the beavers bought it – not on their dime. Clever to list them now.
Bought just under a year ago for $1.333M (cute number).
Listed at $1.598M.
No garage; no laneway house; clever beavers.
Ninja the Toxic Troll cares – that’s why he can’t shut his hole.
What’s wrong with these properties?
139 E 24th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 4: $2,188,000
Change: – 450000.00 -17%
103 3450 David Avenue, Coquitlam
Jul 4: $999,999
Change: – 199001.00 -17%
2195 Sw Marine Drive, Vancouver
Jul 4: $3,299,000
Change: – 981000.00 -23%
968 15th Street, West Vancouver
Jul 4: $1,998,000
Change: – 350000.00 -15%
2390 Nelson Avenue, West Vancouver
Jul 4: $3,098,000
Change: – 490000.00 -14%
2691 Grant Street, Vancouver
Jul 4: $1,299,000
Change: – 201000.00 -13%
5796 16a Avenue, Delta
Jul 3: $1,028,000
Change: – 170000.00 -14%
2386 Shawna Way, Coquitlam
Jul 3: $1,398,000
Change: – 200000.00 -13%
6088 Iona Drive, Vancouver
Jul 3: $1,198,880
Change: – 400120.00 -25%
6933 Arlington Street, Vancouver
Jul 2: $938,000
Change: – 260000.00 -22%
3281 E 7th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 2: $1,198,000
Change: – 230888.00 -16%
756 Southborough Drive, West Vancouver
Jul 2: $4,488,000
Change: – 800000.00 -15%
939 King Georges Way, West Vancouver
Jul 2: $8,998,000
Change: – 1882000.00 -17%
2070 Westdean Crescent, West Vancouver
Jul 2: $2,488,000
Change: – 462000.00 -16%
Pick your best three.
No. Explain all properties or don’t comment on any of them.
If you don’t have an explanation for all these properties then I won the argument.
You’re sounding as idiotic as Ninja the Toxic Twerker.
Sorry, I meant Ninja the Toxic Troll.
That’s a lot of listings with price drops.
C’mon Arnie. Cat got your tongue? There’s gotta be a bog in there somewhere. Maybe a SkyTrain. Or a too-large fridge.
6088 Iona Drive is listed by Nu Stream, so its the usual ploy of listing below assessed to start a bidding war.
How’s that ploy working for them these days?
Maybe Ninja the Toxic Troll can pick three out of the dog’s breakfast of listings. No, that would take knowing something about real estate besides chump charts.
3788 Maxwell: assessed $1.799M
A junko Van Spec in an ok location.
And this “fake ask” tells us what about the market?
This is a shoot for the moon ask – an agent “buying a listing” – as is their habit
When agents sell their own properties, they always list high – see “Freakanomics”.
You can always come down.
Agents will do anything to get a listing – and that all important self-promoting for sale sign marking territory.
I’ve seen agents like Terry Eng list a place at a stratospheric price at 22nd and Boundary that had zero likelihood of being achieved just for the high exposure free mini billboard.
Maxwell St is a good location – top 10%. What this ask says is, if you want a good location – not the dog’s breakfast weirdness posted by 80% deluded, you have to pay big.
You know Arnie is talking out of his a** when he says 3788 Maxwell is a “top 10%” location. First off, it’s in East Van, which automatically puts it in the bottom quartile of Greater Vancouver locations. Second, look at Google street view. An absolutely hideous collection of Chinese specials and other atrocities lined up shoulder to shoulder. This house will sell for 600K in the coming bust.
Ninja the Toxic Troll has his heart set on 2691 Grant St – his dream location.
I lived on Grant St for two years. Not great.
Why? Because it was East Van. The houses are even uglier than the rest of the city. The streets are mostly treeless. Like Maxwell St–not a tree in sight. Lots of through traffic. You’ve got commuters from Burnaby, North Shore, and Fraser Valley all coming and going.
Also, Arnie lives there.
Thankful I left.
Ninja the Toxic Troll admits to living on Grant St.
The only time in his life he was happy – until his landlord kicked him out of his head thumper basement.
Those were the days … his sad sack SPCA rescue dog leaving shit bombs all over Clinton Park.
But Ninja’s real joy was his commanding view of the men’s public toilet. Ninja would spend hours looking out of his window watching who was coming and going. Speculating. Contemplating. Twerking in excitement.
When Arnie’s soggy shack collapses in value and he is forced to go back to work at Starbucks for pennies in tips, he will long the days he could afford to indulge his sociopathy on this forum.
Meantime, the rest of us are left to wonder how this “man” has managed to remain uninstitutionalized.
While prices were galloping forward, speculators were content to forego the hassle of being landlords. As prices stagnate / drop, they are now grasping for compensation by introducing their property to the rental stock. Increased supply = lower rents.
This is just the beginning.
Interesting. We moved in Langley a year ago from our rental of Dec2014-May2017, $2000/mo for a 1996 build 2450sqft with full bsmt to a better for us location, nicer house same size but 1989 build two floor on 7000sqft lot, but had to accept a 40% rent increase to $2800/mo (previous rental was a bit under market, then they didn’t ask for any increases). I tried hard to push the $2800 down, to no avail. So, I watch regularly for a better priced rental in the same area.
As an aside, the $2800/mo is $33,600/year, or close to one partner’s full average $50k income just for a roof! There is virtually no incentive for tenants to overpay like this. We are only willing to do it because my husband had a high paying USD job, and it’s a block from the school.
So, as I watch the CL listings, I regularly call BS on the landlords lying about the square footage of the rentals, in an attempt to justify the overprice. They typically lower the advertised size to only 10% over BC Assess size 🙂
One I recently contacted wrote back (a property agent, not the owner), asking if we were interested. I said, not at current price, as we are prime tenants (credit scores over 830) and not willing to pay anything close to his $3000/mo for 1700sqft listing. He wrote again last week, saying landlord ‘may be willing to lower price for the right tenant’. LOL – not gonna drop it to the $1700 it’s really worth. Of course, his buyer is a 2016 purchaser, as nearly all are, including our current landlords, so likely can’t afford to carry long empty. I wrote back with our rental numbers as above, i.e. his owner is dreaming, not competitive. What a mess.
So many CL listings working hard to push up rents, but so many are ‘available now’, ie just not finding well-heeled tenants willing to pay such insane rents. Am starting to see a few rent ads for lower than expected askings.
We really like the house we’re in, but I consider the $2800 only a temporary expense – will not continue paying it for much longer. And, eventually we will buy, with only a small mortgage or even paying cash. (I’m a -65% bear myself, to support, but Sebastien may well be right with overshoot of mean plus dropping incomes).
Yes, 65%+ is entirely realistic and would be consistent with fundamentals. My concern is that it may take several years to unwind, though the bulk of the crash would likely occur over 2 years. As for rentals, the market will sort itself out eventually. Meantime, lots of BS to wade through, as you say.
I agree Ninja, it will take some-to-many years to come to a nadir, and I’m concerned that by then the economic damage to Vancouver & BC (& Canada) may be so great and so prolonged and so societally damaging as to make it undesirable for us to want to buy here any more.
I also expect that we will probably be pushed out again at least once more by landlords, no doubt after enduring many months of showings, like the 40(!) last time (but that could be an opportunity for a rent reduction :-).
Renters have had quite an advantage here until the last 3-5 years, as rents have been much more tightly coupled to fundamentals. I have no regrets in not rebuying after we sold in 2009, as at any time we could have been buying at the peak. Had we bought, we could have saved everyone else from a massive bubble though – the act of our buying would have caused the BoC to immediately raise rates to normal 🙂
I’m also saddened that good friends have decided to go forward with a huge kitchen reno costing possibly around 8% of current bloated assessed, with a single income family highly exposed to the construction industry. (She agrees with me to not do it at this time, but she can’t talk him out of it!)
Fortunately good equity, but still, if they really believed it might drop 50% or more, they would not do this. Most current homeowners just cannot imagine the massive, sickening drop ahead of us, even those old enough to have seen it in the 80s, like my parents. Most are also pretty ignorant of macroeconomics and why the risk is enormous and unprecedented at this time. Now, how to buy gold? 🙂
Ah, JCH. A kindred spirit.
Yes, lots of family and friends will be blindsided by the coming disaster.
You ask an excellent question: will B.C. / Canada even be an attractive place to own after all is said and done?
Let’s leave aside the tragic social costs that will be incurred (and already have been incurred), and consider just the financial aspect. On one hand, when the bubble bursts, it will be possible to pick up properties on the cheap. On the other, the economic ripple effects will be so severe, and the clamour for restitution so loud, that a government bailout (or attempted bailout) of individual homeowners, municipalities, and banks — not to mention tens if not hundreds of thousand of the newly jobless — seems almost inevitable.
This means MASSIVE increases to Canada’s already suffocating taxes. It means even MORE debt than that Trudeau and others have gleefully laid on current and future generations. It means lower economic growth, less opportunity, and less prosperity for ourselves and our children and grandchildren. It means the state will acquire even greater power as “benefactor” to the people, and hence freedom will be diminished.
Not a version of Canada I’m interested in.
Lastly: yes, buy gold. Canadian real estate is but one piece of a now-global “everything bubble”. Equities, bonds, real estate — they’re all overvalued, the world over, relative to long-term fundamentals. Artificially cheap money everywhere has created a ticking time bomb.
Sovereign Man has some great writing on this. https://www.sovereignman.com
Totally agree, Ninja. It will be an economic disaster here, and I’d rather not be part of the milked. We’ve lived and worked overseas before, and I’d be happy to do it again, so I’m looking into my Swiss roots (grandparent) in case there’s an option for a second passport there.
Also looking to diversify financially, including gold, as we are about 50/50 Canada and US assets, not safe at all.
Also adding to my gardening and energy conservation skills, but really need land ownership somewhere to lower risk more. In the meantime, our tax dollars are getting our kids educated 🙂
I’m not confident that the CAD won’t be worth 0.50 USD or less in the next couple of years, as I think Poloz is severely lacking in personal strength to do what needs to be done – raise rates more, although it’s way too late now anyway.
I think he did a great deal of damage to Canada by lowering the rates in 2015, rather than letting the oil economy take its lumps but avoid further acceleration of Canadian asset bubbles. (Someone should have thought of the universal stress test in 2015!) Due to sovereign debt, I doubt we will ever see interest rates in Canada or US over 3% again, which means I’m expecting a window of opportunity to buy Canadian property, whether we take it or not, in which house prices are dropping steadily, and interest rates are also dropping in desperate attempts to reinflate.
Appreciate the link, looks very helpful for planning.
Yes, Poloz is spineless, and CAD could go much lower.
Less sure about future of interest rates, I could see them going higher, possibly much higher (if history is any guide), to ward off inflation and prevent decimation of loonie — tradeoff being a real estate crash and secondary effects. BofC hands will be tied.
One factor to consider re: relocating is tax residency. If you’ve lived abroad you’re probably aware of this, but when you become a non-resident for tax purposes, all of your investments are deemed by CRA to have been “disposed”, even if you haven’t actually sold them, and you must pay capital gains taxes. It can be a big hit.
But then you are free.
P.S. A second passport is always a good idea.
Noticing scraper flippers pretty regularly:
126 52nd Ave E – bought 2015 for $1.1M – sold 8 months later for $1.61M
Rubbish new-build “Executive” style house (wtf is that)
A massively stupid house on an alley. Dreadful.
Scraper flipper: 3148 Graveley
Bought 2015 for $1.168M – resold 9 months later for $1.555M
New-build listed at $2.698M
Not a great location – five blocks from Ninja’s beloved Clinton Park facilities
ARNIE: your personal attacks are getting old. We put up with visions of bogs, scrapers, etc., but your ongoing revolting “twerking, vomiting” personal insults are too much for me. I now avert my eyes at your postings :-), to avoid yet another disgusting image. So, unfortunately you are losing whatever audience you might have had here by getting personal – I’m sure it’s not just me.
In Vancouver you now have to poke your head in the kitchen and order from the cook directly.
Waitstaff now. Nurses, teachers, sanitary workers next.
Vancouver has become a globalize hub of money laundering and other crimes.
Also, Arnie lives here.
“Money supply is the key”. Bingo.
A real beaut!
3395 Charles St – Ninja is seriously pumped up by his post – his twerky senses were tingling when he saw this.
This is an aspirational bsmt rental for the Ninja – with a view that only someone with his particular peccadillo could appreciate.
Yes, shades of his beloved Grant St bsmt, it too offers a view of the comings and goings at the mens’ room.
Grant St was main floor, but it had a basement, rented by a psycho. One of the charms of living in East Van and Vancouver generally… there’re lots of ’em. It’s why Arnie feels so at home. Plus, houses like this one make his look a little less dumpy.
3637 Haida: scraper bought 3 years ago for $1.549M
Hideous new-build listed at $3.688M
Overpriced by over a million
Kitchen would make a nice morgue.
85 E 18th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 9: $1,899,888
Change: – 498112.00 -21%
8971 Minler Road, Richmond
Jul 8: $1,999,999
Change: – 680001.00 -25%
A: $2,704,000 ( Nu-stream listing but house didn’t sell @ Assessment)
1006 8288 Granville Avenue, Richmond
Jul 8: $519,000
Change: – 70000.00 -12%
3682 E 27th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 9: $1,150,000
Change: – 149000.00 -11%
A: $1,283,500 ( House didn’t sell close to Assessment 🙂 )
Keep ’em coming!
Ninja is highly aroused.
So. Many. Price drops.
Arnie can’t keep up.
Listen to this clown, Phil Doper — I mean Soper — CEO of Royal Losers.
I literally think he takes huge bong hits and it’s affecting his cognition.
Favourite quote from the interview:
“I worry much more about prices accelerating too quickly, than anything resembling a hard landing.”
Have you no shame, Phil?
I also love some of the “feel-good” real estate lingo:
– “Wait and see mood”
– “Adjusted expectations”
And best of all: “A Spring market that never blossomed”.
Seriously, these guys should win a prize for their linguistic acrobatics.
” symptoms of cocaine use often include disorientation, delusions, paranoia, antisocial behavior and aggressiveness.”
This says it all…
6858 Bryant Street, Burnaby
Jul 10: $1,699,999
Change: – 288001.00 -14%
3206 E 54th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 10: $898,000
Change: – 200000.00 -18%
1254 Esquimalt Avenue, West Vancouver
Jul 10: $2,500,000
Change: – 295000.00 -11%
13177 68a Avenue, Surrey
Jul 10: $900,000
Change: – 200786.00 -18%
A: $910,000 ( Under assessed sales now in Surrey 🙂 )
5896 148a Street, Surrey
Jul 10: $825,000
Change: – 124900.00 -13%
1550 E 13th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 10: $1,929,000
Change: – 231000.00 -11%
3329 Puget Drive, Vancouver
Jul 10: $3,389,000
Change: – 799000.00 -19%
4415 Capilano Road, North Vancouver
Jul 10: $1,318,000
Change: – 170000.00 -11%
A: $1,542,400 ( Didn’t sell under-assessed! 😛 )
3656 Blenheim Street, Vancouver
Jul 10: $2,280,000
Change: – 400000.00 -15%
80% deluded – strokin’ the Ninja …
3656 Blenheim was a rental – dog friendly too! The kitchen is a stunner.
Ninja picked out the colours.
3,300 sq ft lot. Yikes.
“80% deluded” — Why? What about the 20%
3656 Blenheim : Kitchens can’t be redone? dog odor can’t disappear? can’t be repainted?
You can’t make lots expand. $690/sq ft is crazy money for a scraper.
Here, a speculator got their knuckles rapped – they threw down $2.38M for this just two years ago. You have that kind of scratch lying around?
Rent doesn’t carry mortgages like this, and a builder would have to charge an insane price to make any money.
At any rate, assuming a zombie apocalypse and doomsday prices, which of the dog’s breakfast of scattered listings would you and the Ninja want to hole up in – eating your tins of sardines?
“You can’t make lots expand.”
Deep thoughts from real estate guru Arnie, aka Jack Handy.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – not a clue – just wants spy on mens’ washrooms, twerk with his dog, and post inanities; an intellectually bankrupt, pro-eugenics, doomsday prepper; a deeply disturbed loser in life.
241 45th Ave E: no view; flanking an alley; crappy old 1 1/2 storey house on a big lot; mindless kitchen redo with walls ripped out to create the illusion of space. Permits and receipts?
Bought 12.7 years ago for $670K
Listed $540K over assessed @ $2.698M
Too expensive to scrape; not good enough to keep.
628 19th Ave E: overpriced turkey of the week
Bought 5 years ago for $1,151,401. – there’s a number that tells a storey
Listed half a mil over assessed, this scrawny 24.9’ wide lot sits on the Tea Swamp.
$2.298M for this? Seriously? No view. No laneway. On a bog.
28 60th Ave E: small lot; no view; ridiculous staging; dreadful dysfunctional kitchens loaded with living room furniture. $2.268M new-build. Style fit for a clown.
636 50th Ave E: facing a dreaded T-junction and, worse, a looming evangelical bell tower.
20 2150 Salisbury Avenue, Port Coquitlam
Jul 11: $699,800
Change: – 99000.00 -12%
7918 Elwell Street, Burnaby
Jul 11: $1,199,000
Change: – 279888.00 -19%
A: $1,239,900 (It’s surprising because this house is in an area poised to be zoned higher density)
231 E Eighth Avenue, New Westminster
Jul 11: $999,900
Change: – 150100.00 -13%
A: $1,002,700 (Same as above)
6718 Arbutus Street, Vancouver
Jul 11: $3,998,000
Change: – 882000.00 -18%
A: $4,015,000 (Let me guess; the kitchen is horrible? The bathrooms need remodeling?)
Arbutus: you’re not guessing – you’re being silly.
It’s on the corner of two traffic streets – endless stop sign action.
It’s listed at almost assessed.
It’s a few blocks from the massive aquifer breach at 7084 Beechwood that has been gushed over a billion litres of water since 2017 and has cost the city over 10 mil to plug so far (google this disaster zone). This whole area is toxic. Far more properties would come up for sale if people thought they could get their money out. Hard to say what’s more disconcerting – having your house sitting/tilting on a bog, or knowing you’re on a crust of earth over an aquifer. In an earthquake, which would be worse?
To be zoned – is different from – zoned – many can’t hang on long enough to capitalize.
lol… nice try but there’s 500 meters between the two addresses. Are you implying that all of south Kerrisdale is at the cusp of collapsing like in the movie “San Andreas” ?
Ninja the Toxic Troll giggled so hard at his perceived wit that he soiled himself – and then proceeded to have a lengthy twerk with his dog while planning his next inanity.
3033 Spuraway Avenue, Coquitlam
Jul 12: $999,999
Change: – 199901.00 -17%
A: $1,283,500 (Didn’t sell under-assessed 🙂 )
3058 Spuraway Avenue, Coquitlam
Jul 12: $1,238,000
Change: – 150000.00 -11%
509 125 E 14th Street, North Vancouver
Jul 12: $788,000
Change: – 111900.00 -12%
Anybody knows more houses like this one?
Authoritarian, boring Vancouver.
Three problems in our beautiful public parks:
Assholes with dogs
To be fair, these are indeed problems in Arnie’s dumpy East Van ‘hood.
And dogs run from him.
Hence his world view.
But these aren’t, in fact, widespread problems in the city. Very little drinking in most parks. Very little smoking in most places too.
A native Vancouverite would know this. But Arnie is a loudmouth import.
Speaking of assholes with dogs …
Arnie’s rhetorical sophistication on full display.
Hey Arnie, don’t step on a used needle as you walk out your front door.
5537 Chancellor Boulevard, Vancouver
Jul 13: $7,988,000
Change: – 1112000.00 -12%
A: $9,157,400 ( Didn’t sell at assessment 😛 )
Last sold in 1978 for $155K
Looks like these poor dead/dying sellers are really taking a beating on this one.
@ the new list that’s only $392/ sq ft – a builder alert – an 8 million dollar scraper
buy and hold – rent it out – with 3 whole bedrooms imagine the money
Busy street – bus route – not desirable
Phoney expert Arnie blows smoke again.
This is one of the most desirable neighborhoods in Vancouver.
Is the house worth $8m? No. Maybe half that.
Take your meds
You guys have to read this: http://www.courts.gov.bc.ca/jdb-txt/sc/18/11/2018BCSC1156.htm
Sad, but true.
3657 W 37th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 15: $3,180,000
Change: – 1000000.00 -24%
A: $4,183,000 ( Didn’t sell @ assessment. It’s a Nu-Stream listing but an asking price 24% under-assessed is still pretty grim. Drug money quietly leaving?)
Canadian “journalism”, bought and paid for by CREA.
Official Chinese growth statistics are faker than the botoxed faces of Vancouver’s nouveau riche.
302 1331 Alberni Street, Vancouver
Jul 16: $599,900
Change: – 160000.00 -21%
A: $629,000 ( Surprising for a downtown condo)
4876 4 Avenue, Delta
Jul 16: $1,380,000
Change: – 218000.00 -14%
6388 Dawn Drive, Delta
Jul 16: $999,888
Change: – 123112.00 -11%
5796 16a Avenue, Delta
Jul 16: $998,000
Change: – 200000.00 -17%
2244 Austin Avenue, Coquitlam
Jul 16: $1,249,900
Change: – 349900.00 -22%
A: $1,288,000 ( Should be rezoned soon)
9751 Pinewell Crescent, Richmond
Jul 16: $1,599,000
Change: – 229000.00 -13%
8115 Strathearn Avenue, Burnaby
Jul 16: $1,498,000
Change: – 190000.00 -11%
And by that, of course, I mean double-digit declines.
6207 Buchanan Street, Burnaby
Jul 17: $1,650,000
Change: – 318000.00 -16%
13439 56 Avenue, Surrey
Jul 17: $1,299,000
Change: – 249000.00 -16%
6588 Portland Street, Burnaby
Jul 17: $999,999
Change: – 799001.00 -44%
A: $1,487,400 ( Someone trying to avoid the registry?)
2905 Marine Drive, West Vancouver
Jul 17: $2,895,000
Change: – 585000.00 -17%
Th5 8333 Anderson Road, Richmond
Jul 18: $999,000
Change: – 189000.00 -16%
1012 E 20th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 18: $948,000
Change: – 240000.00 -20%
1402 Chartwell Drive, West Vancouver
Jul 18: $5,988,000
Change: – 992000.00 -14%
4710 Willow Place, West Vancouver
Jul 18: $2,380,000
Change: – 618000.00 -21%
25 1881 144 Street, Surrey
Jul 18: $999,000
Change: – 351000.00 -26%
More dog’s breakfast …
Surrey townhouse on 144 – two hours of agony round trip to Vancouver. Dropped 6.2% from assessed. Yabba dabba.
Bought for $377K in ‘02 = 164% gain while living out there in the boonies
The only example of a good deal you’ve provided to date is the one near Beaconsfield Park – where the old guy died at 92, ow just nonsense.
Ninja started drooling when he heard dog’s breakfast. Regurgitated Ol’ Roy is his favourite. Thas’ good eatin’ says Ninja. Puts me in the mood to Twerk and Troll.
What does this even mean?
Surrey townhouse on 144 – if you are right, how come White Rock is so expensive then?
Ninja the Toxic Troll is confused due to lack of nutrient from his steady diet of ‘Ol Roy.
5206 Chester St: new-build No Frills location; below grade; small lot; graveyard view; E-W orientation; mindless layout – $2.75M. Insane. Awful.
It’s a 5 min walk from Queen Elizabeth park though.
It’s a 20 min walk.
You walk 700m in 25 mins? I’m sorry to hear that.
1754 34th Ave E: schizo design. Dreadful. $2.899M. Nowhere near Skytrain. Ridiculous.
It’s a 10-15 min walk from Nanaimo station.
It’s 25 min – try that with groceries, or kids – at least an hour walking round trip.
Why go grocery shopping on skytrain when there’s the Famous Foods 10 mins away? Why would you need to skytrain with your kids if not for the rare occasion?
1842 64th Ave E: scraper flipper:
2015 – $1.065M; 7 months later – $1,540,002.
That extra $2.00 is hilarious.
New-build now – $2.499M
That’s a lot of churn.
Literally no one cares about your “scraper flippers” (whatever that means). Literally no one.
You’re like the loser at the party who can’t shut up about real estate. Except that guy actually gets invited to parties.
Ninja the Toxic Troll vomiting and eating his dog’s breakfast of ‘Ol Roy – wishing he had something to say.
Curious why Ninja cares so deeply; so ardently.
To be honest, in costs more than 1,000,000$ to rebuild a house in Vancouver if you include all the red tape and permits. At 2.5 mil, the profit margin is about 15-20% max. If they have to lower the price by about 300,000$, they’ll be in the red.
More than a million to rebuild a house in Vancouver? Pure fiction. Try watching Love it or List it Vancouver, none of their professional permitted renovations are more than 30% of that figure.
You don’t have a clue what it costs – to be honest.
When I say rebuild, I mean from the foundation up, not just renovating the cabinets and repainting. In some cases, yes it’ll be more than 1 mil. The gouging by the contractors, PTT, permits, delays, etc…
2887 W 39th Avenue, Vancouver
Jul 19: $4,399,000
Change: – 1000000.00 -19%
4951 Wintergreen Avenue, Richmond
Jul 19: $1,299,990
Change: – 399010.00 -23%
2887 39th – see that nasty traffic street that runs flush with this ppty? It’s a horrible location. Another fake drop from a hopeful ask.
McDonald street has nasty traffic? Google maps gives it green all day long.
It might not be gridlocked, but it never stops.
It’s 100% residential. I doubt there’s traffic weeknights.
Wintergreen – look at the lot and location before you do your silly posts. You can figure it out – or are you as asinine as Ninja?
The location is actually quite good. You can walk to Terra Nova park and you’re close to a small mall.
The lot is irregular and faces a T.
It’s Richmond North. There are tons of lots like this one (shape and T). You don’t think the assessment has taken it into account?
2754 Dundas: bought 8 months ago for $1.25M – listed at a 3/4M bump.
The location is quite good though. Near the highway and PNE. How do you know that someone will buy it @ 2,000,000$?
Proximity is good, though not to Skytrain. Dundas gets a lot of rat runners going to Renfrew St. That area in general is very good.
Why the need for the skytrain when you can just hop on a bus on Hastings that is 200 m away?
Bulls aren’t liking what they see, calling it “fake”.
Denial is the first stage of the grieving process.
Then comes anger.
Ninja the Toxic Troll serving up another vomit of ‘Ol Roy.
And the drops just keep comin’.
I love how bulls have gone from bragging about price increases, to making excuses for declines.
Scrambling, ever more frantically, to plug the leaks on their sinking ship.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – the basement oracle – how’s the ‘Ol Roy vomit tasting – up to your usual standard?
3691 Georgia St E: Do locations get worse than this … on Boundary Rd … power lines overhead. This new-build with two rat suites could be yours for $2.079M + GST. Open House this weekend – line up early.
It’s an awesome location actually. Near the highway, The PNE, Hastings ( transit, shops, restaurants, etc…). You can take a bus for DT and be there in like 25 mins. When it comes to traffic, you can always change windows and put a cedar hedge and other things like that. The power lines affect home values in what way?
A lot of buyers actually love the rental suites… mortgage helpers. It’s a brand new house up to code and everything.
If this listing drops in price it’s because the market sours and only because of that.
Arnie remarks on aspects of a property that anyone — even small children — can easily see, and which are therefore priced in to any assessment. Fridge too big? People can see that and allocate value accordingly. Not close enough to a SkyTrain? That, too, is clear to anyone who cares to consider the property. And the list goes on. Whatever deficiencies are apparent to Arnie, are apparent to everyone else. Arnie’s judgment is mere noise. Useless ranting. A waste of pixels.
As Sebastien says, anything listed under assessment is a reflection of a tanking market, not some secret defect that only keyboard warrior Arnie is able to detect.
Bears in the wilderness – looking for a bag of ‘Ol Roy to share while commiserating.
20 2590 Panorama Drive, Coquitlam
Jul 20: $699,000
Change: – 100999.00 -13%
11895 89a Avenue, Delta
Jul 20: $668,000
Change: – 107000.00 -14%
A 1000 sq ft rancher in Delta? You are desperate. No worry about being overrun with hipsters here.
.16% under assessed.
But it’s not a bad location. Tons of shops and in between the two highways. It’s perfect house if you work in Surrey’s industrial park.
Annie getting owned, listing by listing. Entertaining to watch.
On a road trip right now. Stunning scenery. Wonderful communities.
World’s a big place, y’all. And Vancouver ain’t the center of it.
Autocorrect for “Arnie” is “Annie”. I’m gonna run with that.
Ninja the Toxic Troll regurgitating another bowl of ‘Ol Roy. So many made money in real estate in Vancouver over the past 150 years. Not the Toxic Troll – he just wants to eat ‘Ol Roy with his sad dog, barf it up, woof it down again, and have a twerk party. Even his sad dog is planning his escape from this sad loser.
“So many made money in real estate in Vancouver over the past 150 years.”
Transplant Annie doesn’t know basic history of the city he moved to.
Vancouver wasn’t even a city until 1886.
These are metrics that savvy real estate investors are keenly aware of.
But there is an even more important one:
The greater, the better.
Good time for Ninja the Toxic Troll to pretend to go hide.
Are you kidding me? 15 people in a 1700 sq ft townhouse?!? I feel sorry for the rest of the strata.
This is what an unregulated (El Ninja’s dream) market looks like. North Vancouver Bylaw officers visit, and the law has no teeth. I hope there isn’t a fire, the income is being properly declared, the relevant local taxes are being paid, and the new strata fine level of $1000 per day is being imposed.
Baiting the Toxic Troll.
Keith: People need to pay taxes!
Non-violent person: So, it’s okay for me to seize your property and, if you don’t comply, to put you in a cage at gunpoint?
Keith: Of course not. You don’t have that right.
Non-violent person: But that’s what taxes are.
Keith: But, uh, “government”.
Non-violent person: Government is just other people. By what logic can one group grant to another a right that they themselves don’t possess?
By what logic can one group grant to another a right that they themselves don’t possess?
Via a democratic electoral process.
So if a group of people votes to steal your property, that doesn’t make it theft?
Ninja the Toxic Troll is going to call you gay; giggle like a school girl; then run off and twerk with his sad sack dog.
If you believe that taxation by a democratically elected government for the purpose of funding public services is theft there is nothing I can say that would change this belief. If you hold this point of view strongly, I will safely assume that you are hard at work financing and campaigning for Libertarian politicians. If you aren’t, it’s because you don’t believe your point of view is widely held in society. Enjoy life on the fringe.
You didn’t answer my question. Be honest, Keith.
I’ll make it simple for you.
If there are three of us on a desert island and, after you’ve worked hard to hunt for food, two of us “vote” to take it from you — by force if necessary — is it, or is it not, theft? And if it’s theft on the island, why isn’t it when done at the national level?
Democracy is just mob rule.
El Ninja, when you try to reduce complex government and economic systems involving millions of people to pat questions and a model consisting of a desert island with three people on it, there is no need to answer. Go back to the drawing board.
Keith, what is moral at the level of society must also be moral at the level of the individual.
Murder is immoral whether carried out by one person or by an army of thousands. Theft is immoral whether done by an individual or at scale. And so on.
You are dodging a basic question, because you have no morally consistent answer to it.
You persist in defining taxation as theft. We can engage in circular arguments about how useful that definition is in the real world but that would be a waste of time. My recommendation stands, that you join with likeminded Libertarians and go about the process of eliminating the theft.
The Libertarian party can use your money and your time. Their lack of electoral success suggests that it is a fringe movement whose ideas lack traction. If you are sincere in your opinion, you should go and get stuck in. Less taxes, less theft, a better world. Have at it.
By the way, do you live in a low tax jurisdiction, if so what are the advantages and disadvantages?
You keep suggesting I become active in the libertarian party instead addressing the arguments I have made.
You have tried to mock / diminish libertarianism by calling it “fringe”.
Guess what, Keith? The fact that an idea is seen as fringe in no way invalidates it. The civil rights movement, and so many of the standards and values we hold dear today, were at one time seen as “fringe”.
Libertarianism is growing as people awaken from their societal programming. It’s my hope that we will one day look back on our current system in much the same way as we do now on slavery: with incredulity.
I’m not mocking the Libertarian party by calling it fringe, I’m classifying it. No need to diminish a party that has a handful of electoral victories at the state level and hasn’t come anywhere close to opposition, much less government. Don’t be so sensitive. It’s not mainstream by a long way, but a quick internet search shows triple the votes of the Green party in the U.S.
Republican Donald Trump 62,985,105 45.94% -0.7%
Democratic Hillary Clinton 65,853,625 48.03% -3.3%
Libertarian Gary Johnson 4,489,233 3.27% +2.3%
Green Jill Stein 1,457,222 1.06% +0.7%
Others Others 2,313,258 1.68% +1.0%
Turnout 134,754,939 100%
I’ve responded to your demand that I answer your “question.” Go ahead and answer mine.
You STILL haven’t answered my question about the moral implications of taxation.
What is your question? I haven’t seen one.
You have searched Google and arrived at a “classification” of libertarianism as fringe. So what? What is your point? That because a majority of people haven’t accepted something, it isn’t worth contemplating? Do you get all of your opinions from others? Be an independent thinker, Keith.
At one time a majority of people saw gravity as fringe. Electricity was fringe, too. Galileo, Darwin, Tesla, Edison — and so many others — were dismissed as eccentrics.
By definition, all improvements represent departures from established, majority-accepted norms.
Do you really think that we have reached the pinnacle of human achievement? I’m sure the kings of past thought the same. History shows that we have evolved through many iterations, from hunter-gatherers, to feudalism and monarchies, to modern-day democracy. I see no reason that we won’t continue to develop new and better systems of organization.
This is my question, from July 30, 4:39 p.m. Do you see it now?
By the way, do you live in a low tax jurisdiction, if so what are the advantages and disadvantages?
I don’t know what your question means. Public services are not funded exclusively from the taxes within your specific jurisdiction. They are funded from a range of sources, including local taxes, state taxes, and federal taxes. And also by the debt raised by each of these entities, and by the private contributions made to public projects. With this pooling of funds it is difficult to make conclusions re: “advantages” and “disadvantages”. Obviously it is preferable to live in a low-tax jurisdiction. I currently do not, but that has nothing to do with my views on this subject, and everything to do with other factors job and family-related.
How about you answer my questions?
I have noticed the detached housing for sale signs in Vancouver are staying up much longer than last year.
2836 45th Ave E: buyer overpaid by a few hundred K in ‘06 and wants to recoup. After paying for the renos and costs of transactions and carrying, this busy beaver is not going to make money on this sad old tarted-up house – even if someone pays full whack for this no view location on the massive Killarney Bog.
628 Union: not that long ago the city tried to bulldoze Strathcona – said the place was a slum unfit for habitation. Now, this 113-year-old house on a skinny lot with no lane is priced at two mil. Ad says two beds could be easily suited. Right. If it were easy, it would have been done a long time ago.
574 51st Ave E: lipstick flip. Bought in March of this year for $1.47M.
Listed at $1.988M.
That buys a lot of paint.
Something no one is talking about.
The quality of women in Vancouver.
It’s not high.
Yes, there are exceptions. But, on average, not great. Frumpily dressed.
Montreal? Different story. Even Toronto beats Vancouver on this score.
Of course, if you’re married, or gay, like Annie, this is a moot point. But let’s be honest, if you’re a young straight male deciding where to forge your future, it’s one less reason to get excited about Vancouver.
This had to be said.
Ninja the Toxic Troll offers the babes good times in his basement rental and intimate dinners of ‘Ol Roy. Dining and twerking and regurgitating.
As a guy who grew up in Montreal I can talk for hours about this topic.
Here’s my theory: Women have a biological need to nest. Because RE are so lunatic here, it pushed them to chase the few who can actually afford a house or to stay single for life. So hypergamy has been ramped up to 11 for a stupid reason. Also, men here are living incredibly fake and endetted lives because of this.
My gf is more a crunchy type girl so I found my needle in a haystack.
1725 W 15th Street, North Vancouver
Jul 30: $999,888
Change: – 588112.00 -37%
A: $1,233,300 ( Flipper burned: Last bought April 2016 for 1.15 mil$)
8840 Harvie Road, Surrey
Jul 30: $798,600
Change: – 189400.00 -19%
16691 Mapletree Close, Surrey
Jul 30: $999,000
Change: – 239000.00 -19%
6627 Humphries Avenue, Burnaby
Jul 27: $999,000
Change: – 599000.00 -37%
3255 Mayne Crescent, Coquitlam
Jul 27: $848,000
Change: – 251900.00 -23%
4409 W 16TH AVENUE, Vancouver
Hoochyman – proof positive that any idiot and his dog can be a real estate rodent.
The assessment is for 4405 16th Ave W – a double lot.
4409 is a single lot.
The house is an awful pretentious pile with no laneway house on a de facto speedway – which is why there are so often radar traps set up.
A crap location like this should have been built cheap; with a laneway house and maximum bedrooms. This close to UBC, it would be easily jammed with students. This build is a massive waste of money – stupid.
6821 Heather Street, Vancouver
Jul 31: $3,197,000
Change: – 693000.00 -18%
This is a nice spot for someone with a few million to spend.
I wouldn’t buy it. For this kind of cash it has to be south-facing and it has to have a view. To spend millions and not get a view – in this beautiful city – is foolhardy. Doesn’t appear to have a suite, and there’s no laneway house. The lot width is unfortunate: 57’. Nine feet wider and it would be simple to subdivide and recoup.
Bought for $960K just over 20 years ago, these folks have profited wildly while enjoying their home – and are ready to move on. Next stop – oblivion.
I don’t care if you would buy it or not. A 700000$ drop in 3 months is not a balanced market.
“these folks have profited wildly while enjoying their home”.
They haven’t profited one iota until they actually sell. Then, to calculate their true profit, you would have to consider the opportunity cost on the 960K they tied up for two decades. You would also have to consider the thousands upon thousands of dollars they have spent on property taxes, insurance, maintenance, repairs, and so on. Then, you would have to consider inflation–the purchasing power of a dollar today is only about two-thirds what it was 20 years ago.
They may have borne other, non-financial costs, too. Such as pests. Or psycho neighbors.
After all is said and done, their return will be peanuts. Especially if the price needs to drop more.
Double-digit declines. Fridge must be too big. Or there’s a bog nearby.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – trying to be funny.
Currently swinging through my hometown of Vancouver as part of my epic summer road trip.
What a changed city it is, and not for the better. When I was a kid in the late 70s and 80s, Vancouver was a cool city. Kids running around. Vibrant neighborhoods.
My old neighborhood in Point Grey is like a ghost town now. Empty streets.
All because of cheap debt, rampant real estate speculation, foreign money and corrupt governments. It’s really sad.
Traffic is brutal. So many a**hole drivers. Couldn’t wait to get out of downtown, what a sh*t-show that was to drive through.
City streets are narrow and not designed to accommodate so many vehicles. No expressways.
This is not world class.
I might go to Starbucks tomorrow. Annie, are you still working your barista magic?
“swinging through” = epically deluded twerking
C’mon, Annie. Crack a book. Those community college entrance exams aren’t going to write themselves. Make Schulz proud!
4797 The Glen, West Vancouver
Aug 1: $4,498,000
Change: – 1882000.00 -29%
A: $4,709,000 ( Perfect example of stubborn/OCD seller. Waited almost 8 months to change the price)
139 E 24th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 1: $2,088,000
Change: – 550000.00 -21%
More sour grapes from Ninja the Toxic Troll. Completely missed the boat – so bitter and angry. Blames everyone except his parents. Just him and his sad sack dog sharing a bowl of ‘Ol Roy in his basement rental. Regurgitate and twerk. Regurgitate and twerk …
The Glen – car dependent enclave; hideous commuting – bought 5 years ago for $2.68M. Current list is $1.82M above that. Boo hoo.
24th Ave – bought for $345K 18 years ago. Current list is $1.743M above that. Boo hoo. Hipsters will be hot for this one even though there’s no lane and keeping a 1912 house running is a challenge.
The Glen – Wouldn’t you like the lack of traffic? ” Hideous commuting” my a@@, 40 mins max from downtown.
24th Ave – 100+ years old houses have their fans. Look at Queen’s Park in New West, theses homes are 3-4 mil$ on average.
Would not live at the Glen. I drive once or twice a week. That’s enough. Would live in Queen’s Park. Nice. Would trade for one of their old mansions. But prefer the fabulous East Side.
100 year old homes can be great, but they have their idiosyncrasies; not for the inexperienced.
Drove through “fabulous” East Van today. Reminded me what a treeless wasteland it is. Terrible traffic. No views, with exception of a few areas. Even the street with the best views in East Van — Wall Street — is not really that great.
Also, Arnie lives there.
Arnie, what’s your point?
5516 Lanark: “Luxury” Van Spec Dreck with the usual illegal second suite on the massive Dumfries Bog. Undesirable west-facing. $2.688M. Crazy money for this boring location nowhere near Skytrain.
Arnie is a bot that spits out the same words in different combinations. “Bog”, “SkyTrain”, “rodent”.
Wouldn’t like this place due to the lack of traffic?
265 44th Ave E: assessed at $2.199M. Listed at $2,799,999.00. Not my cuppa, but it will achieve close to this price.
You’re sure that this place will sell @ 2.8mil$? 242 45th Avenue E is for sale at the same price and it’s a brand new build.
3511 Wellington: bought 2003 for $570K; assessed $2.072M; listed at $3.15M. Looks like a scraper/land assembly price.
The listing has been removed.
Arnie thinks list price = worth. He’s that dumb.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – your turn at the ‘Ol Roy bowl. Your sad sack dog just finished barfing it up. You two make a nice couple.
Starbucks barista Annie wows us again with his cogent and sophisticated posts.
Hey Annie, I hear Schulz helps employees fund their post-secondary studies. There are courses in finance, economic, and logic that may benefit you. If you’re granted admission, that is. Study hard!
Ninja the Toxic Troll is as idiotic as the self-entitled ridiculous Jessica Barrett – who thought Vancouver should provide her with lodgings for knowing where to find 24hr dosa; and a nude beach.
At least she had the honesty to say how much she loved this city – BPOE.
Like Ninja the Toxic Troll, she could have swung a deal before the big runup, but she was too busy being full of herself.
When her parents kick off and she inherits, she’ll be back here quicker than Ninja slurps up a bowl of regurgitated ‘Ol Roy.
Maybe they’ll meet; become soul twerkers.
148 E 64th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 2: $1,668,800
Change: – 430200.00 -20%
B1007 3331 Brown Road, Richmond
Aug 2: $499,900
Change: – 79100.00 -14%
14046 Coldicutt Avenue, Surrey
Aug 3: $1,268,000
Change: – 430800.00 -25%
1109 7360 Elmbridge Way, Richmond
Aug 3: $438,000
Change: – 100000.00 -19%
A: $466,700 ( Surprising for a condo)
715 Southborough Drive, West Vancouver
Aug 3: $5,500,000
Change: – 1180000.00 -18%
Speaking of Surrey, was just there yesterday.
Friend told me about a house down the street — nothing special — asking $1.6 m.
I repeat. Surrey.
Dreaming in technicolor.
Neighbours think they’ve hit the jackpot.
If only they knew.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – hoping to drive until he qualified. No, even Wacky Whalley is out of his price range.
You couldn’t pay me to live in Vancouver these days.
Heading home to sunny California.
Watch your step around those used needles, Annie.
313 7326 Antrim Avenue, Burnaby
Aug 7: $486,000
Change: – 113800.00 -19%
408 Marmont Street, Coquitlam
Aug 7: $899,000
Change: – 231000.00 -20%
5375 Cecil Street, Vancouver
Aug 7: $1,299,000
Change: – 526000.00 -29%
324 Montroyal Boulevard, North Vancouver
Aug 7: $1,950,000
Change: – 429000.00 -18%
3280 Lamond Avenue, Richmond
Aug 7: $1,485,000
Change: – 203000.00 -12%
2516 E 12th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 8: $1,499,000
Change: – 200000.00 -12%
A: $1,784,000 (Didn’t sell under-assessed 🙂 )
This would be worth buying if not for the creek running beneath it and having the Grandview Gardens subsidized housing project in back. That it is a viewless squat unimproved early Van Spec Dreck doesn’t help. Nice try – at least it’s located in what normal people call Vancouver.
The creek has been piped a long time ago and subsidized housing projects are all over town so you’re obsessing over trivial things. This house is at a walking distance of almost everything: Commercial drive, skytrain, schools, parks, the highway, etc… Most people don’t buy a house for “the view”, those who want a nice view buy a highrise condo.
“Housing projects all over town” … Really?
People don’t buy a house with a view because they can’t afford it. They buy on crap viewless traffic streets because it’s cheaper.
Condos vs houses – apples and oranges.
Creek piped – nice until you try to put in a dungeon basement.
Where are all the raging bulls? Run for the mountains?
Brian, Space, BLM, and so many others… vanished. Shot their mouths off when times were good. Now too spineless to admit they were wrong.
Only Annie left. Because, well, sociopathy.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – missing those who see him as a bonehead.
Ninja the Toxic Troll. The Point Grey boy wonder coming off a hot twerk with his dog. Wondering what happened. Nothing useful to contribute.
“Nothing useful to contribute”.
The bulls are eating a reality sandwich, their hopes of ever-rising real estate prices dashed.
Keyboard warrior Annie lingers. Like a bad fart.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – ready to pretend to go away. Growing up in the privilege of Point Grey, it must be particularly galling to see success; and failure in the mirror.
“Failure” for Annie = not buying into a bloated real estate market that is destined for collapse.
Backwards thinkers like Annie can actually be useful: Do the opposite of whatever they say, and you’ll do well.
C’mon, Annie. Crack a book. Those community college entrance exams aren’t going to write themselves. Make Schulz proud!
Ninja the Toxic Troll – can’t afford Whalley, or Guildford … try Moncton – they’re desperate for people.
But the BPOE – you missed out. Man up; suck it up; the way you suck up regurgitated ‘Ol Roy.
Vancouver is full of insecure people. If you haven’t jointed the RE frenzy, they’ll attack you in order to feel better about their own poor judgment. Like the losers in high school that gave you the gears when didn’t drink and drive.
What they don’t realize is that for many of us, it’s not a matter of affordability; it’s a matter of rationality.
I can *afford* to buy a house in Point Grey. I can afford a lot of things. But that doesn’t mean I’m going to go out and buy one. Doing so in this market would violate my obligations as steward of my family’s capital.
Tune out the insecure RE ranters. Do what’s sensible for yourself and those you are responsible for.
On this point: how insecure does a city have to be to yap about itself as the “Best Place on Earth”?
Seriously, that’s like going around saying you’re the best-looking person to have ever lived.
At best you won’t be taken seriously and, at worst, you’ll get punched in the face.
Lesson for today’s Vancouverites.
Three scenarios, you can only choose one.
Again, Keith, think critically.
BC Business is bought and paid for by vested interests.
This garbage piece is of zero analytical value. Zero.
Everything that is or ever has been published is bought and paid for by vested interests, or reflects the bias of the person doing the research, or is the bought and paid for conclusion of the interest group or person that commissioned it. Everyone selects facts that support their point of view, and ignores or discounts as irrelevant those that don’t. Your comment makes a painfully obvious point. This piece is humor, something that you struggle to recognize.
Yours is a fatalistic, “nothing really matters” view. That’s not helpful.
Objectivity does exist, and should be pursued doggedly. It forms the very foundation of the scientific method.
Oh, and this piece was supposed to be funny? You’re right, I did struggle to notice that. There’s no accounting for taste, I guess.
Thanks Keith, love the article.
The author seems to not see the various chain reactions that would make scenario #3 transform into scenario #1.
3115 Alberta Street, Vancouver
Aug 9: $1,049,000
Change: – 151000.00 -13%
9791 Stilmond Road, Richmond
Aug 9: $1,988,000
Change: – 310000.00 -13%
A: $2,027,000 (310k gone in 4 days…)
343 E 32nd Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 9: $1,498,000
Change: – 200000.00 -12%
A: $1,790,000 ( Didn’t sell under-assessed 😛 )
1897 W 37th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 9: $4,500,000
Change: – 888000.00 -16%
39 4900 Cartier Street, Vancouver
Aug 9: $1,450,000
Change: – 549999.00 -27%
4270 Staulo Crescent, Vancouver
Aug 9: $1,270,000
Change: – 280000.00 -18%
A: $3,378,000 ( Does someone has more info on this listing?)
4270 Staulo Crescent is a lease-hold property, so for $1.27 million, you get to use the building until 2073.
But why was it assessed at $3.3M?
Presumably its worth (assessed) $3.378 million to the lessor? As the lessee..not so much?
U.S. is leading indicator:
109 2455 York Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 10: $999,900
Change: – 200100.00 -17%
6622 Parkdale Drive, Burnaby
Aug 10: $2,478,000
Change: – 520000.00 -17%
2526 Edgar Crescent, Vancouver
Aug 10: $3,380,000
Change: – 1488000.00 -31%
A: $3,998,100 (Seller didn’t follow the market)
5050 Fraser Street, Vancouver
Aug 10: $1,299,000
Change: – 700999.00 -35%
A: $1,270,900 (Selling 35% over-assessed in this market, really? The seller’s bubble just popped!)
6614 Parkdale Drive, Burnaby
Aug 10: $2,668,000
Change: – 831000.00 -24%
The interesting thing about 5050 Fraser is not the original ask, but that the Real Estate Rodent, in a time when many have no listings at all, has 8 just on this street. She promises the moon – quacking about land assemblies -most properties at a million over assessed. Once the sellers are hooked and signed, she figures out who to beat down in price. 5050 Fraser, on a godawful high traffic street overlooking the graveyard, is as undesirable as it gets – unless some ghoulish entrepreneur plans to build a new funeral home. Last sold in ‘92 for $189K, the seller is no doubt old and gaga.
CEO of Royal LeDump, Phil Doper, thinks sales are set to “surge”.
I literally think this guy gets extremely high on a regular basis.
1790 Charles: assessed $1.824M. Listed at $2.799M. It will sell for close to that. One in four properties sold in Vancouver is demolished. This oldie will be scraped and replaced with dupexes.
Fixer-uppers will become increasingly rare. The property that was bought for a few hundred thousand 10-20 years ago will morph into a $2.5M+ Van Spec Dreck, or townhouses.
You’re sure it’ll sell @ 2.8 mil? You have a crystal ball?
2614 18th Ave E: a repellent new simulacrum of a mausoleum with “Every detail laboured over …” – has the cheapest “fence” possible – a line of bargain basement cedars. Cheap cheap cheap. Location is pretty good though. $2.298M. This silly white house will look like a soiled diaper in a few years – major ugly.
1275 24th Ave E: bought in 2016 for $1.5M, which is current assessed. Reno’ed and listed at $2.2M. Ridiculous. Assessment footage is given as 1,644 sq ft. Listed footage is 2,470 sq ft. No way. Absolutely no way. Dishonest bullshit.
pffft! … https://tinyurl.com/y8mo9kow
There is an exodus of people from Vancouver.
Why would they stay?
Even the libertarians hate California. Why do you stay?
Keith, who was unable to answer me about the morality of coerced charity, now shoots arrow over my bow with this dumb question. Thinks he’s caught me in some sort of personal inconsistency.
How about you not be a creep and mind your own business, Keith?
How about you realize that one’s choice of locale (in my case, a temporary locale) is not made exclusively on the basis of one’s philosophical / political leanings, but on a complex mix of familial, social, and career-related considerations?
The intent of my post, which was apparently lost on you, was not to nit-pick about the personal choices of one individual, but to remark that, to many, Vancouver seems to be offering decreasing appeal.
Are those who remain hypocrites, as you have suggested of me? No, they are not. Their personal views on the matter may be superseded by other, entirely legitimate factors.
Life’s complicated, Keith. Nice try, though.
So El Ninja who has dissed Vancouver literally dozens of times, for every reason he can think of, can’t take a response concerning the place he lives in. Oh dear.
Months ago on this very blog I pointed out that even super wealthy Jimmy Pattison chose to live in Vancouver to be close to his mother, so I fully understand why people choose to live where they live. I note that hasn’t stopped you questioning why anyone would live in Vancouver repeatedly on this blog. You have trashed Vancouver dozens of times, economically socially and in any way you can think of. Vancouver’s issues are shared by many cities, particularly in North America yet you feel the need to point them out repeatedly in your comments. Mind my own business? Take a look in the mirror.
When I dis Vancouver, I speak of the place in general terms. I don’t make a point of questioning specific individuals’ choice to live there or not, because I know that, on the micro level, there may be valid mitigating circumstances. But on the macro level, it’s not surprising that people are leaving. This difference seems to have confused you.
Also, when I dis Vancouver, I don’t make it political. I speak of the absurd real estate prices, the economic stagnation, and so on. These (non-political) themes are among the prime factors that people consider when choosing a place to live and invest. Whether or not their personal political views are perfectly aligned with prevailing government policies is of relative irrelevance to most. This, too, seems to have confused you.
As for whether or not Vancouver deserves critique…
First of all, this blog is the VANCOUVER real estate archive. Note the name in the title. So, naturally, the main subject of my comments is Vancouver.
Second, deflecting criticism of Vancouver by saying that other cities have similar problems is not helpful. Vancouver needs to confront its own problems if it is to find solutions.
Third, many of Vancouver’s failings are arguably more acute that most cities’. If you travel (or just read), you will quickly observe that the city outranks virtually all others in real estate speculation and lack of affordability, household debt, fraud, tax evasion, homelessness, drug trade, and its cultural obsession around real estate and materialism in general. To name but a few.
Think critically, Keith.
5488 Sperling Avenue, Burnaby
Aug 12: $2,999,000
Change: – 800000.00 -21%
7518 North Fraser Way, Burnaby
Aug 12: $8,900,000
Change: – 1980000.00 -18%
A: $96,992 (This address should have its ALR status revoked ASAP. Foreign and local speculators can flip this land and pay peanuts in taxes.)
7733 Burgess Street, Burnaby
Aug 12: $1,250,000
Change: – 200000.00 -14%
A: $1,252,200 (Flipper burned: bought in 2016 for $1,200,000)
7324 Braeside Drive, Burnaby
Aug 12: $2,388,000
Change: – 292000.00 -11%
4711 Pendlebury Road, Richmond
Aug 12: $2,990,000
Change: – 400000.00 -12%
1051 Wolfe Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 12: $7,888,000
Change: – 4112000.00 -34%
A: $6,352,000 (It seems that the ultra-elite market is going down but not under-assessed yet.)
Wolfe – bought 25 years ago for $740K. That extra 7 million will pay for a lot of gaga care.
Burgess – no flipper burn. They lived in the house for 3 years. That would cost the better part of a $100K, so a break even at worst.
Wolfe -I don’t care about prices 25 years ago. If you want to myopically focus on prices decades ago that’s your thing. Did you know you could buy a house for 20$ 100 years ago?
Burgess – Yes the flipper got burned. Add taxes, realtor fees, staging costs… Where does your 100k$ comes from?
You don’t care about reality.
Exodus from Vancouver – maybe companies should just pay people more and be competitive with other places on total comps. Ever wonder why tech companies in Toronto can pay 50%+ or more, Silicon Valley can pay 200%+ more for talent and still profitable while Vancouver can’t? Is Vancouver some kind of magic black hole where if a company pays anything above “slave wages” it will just magically not make any $$?
Exodus? What exodus? This isn’t Moncton. Vancouver is growing. Lougheed Mall is the second biggest development in North America after New York’s Hudson Yards. The Oakridge development is the biggest in Vancouver’s history. The transformations in Brentwood, Joyce/Collingwood, Marine, Cambie … The pace is mind-boggling.
Some who come to Vancouver, and those who were born here, can’t make it happen. That’s reality. Off they go. That’s a good thing for those who succeed.
But look at former curbstoner Greedy Jim. He’s managed to stick billions of dollars into his pockets. Say what you will about him, and I find him utterly loathsome and repellent, he doesn’t whine.
You’re confusing population boom with construction boom. Not the same thing.
You are wilfully confused.
INVESTMENT ALERT: A mall is being renovated. Buy now!
513-6028 Willingdon Avenue, Burnaby
Aug 13: $450,000
Change: – 99000.00 -18%
6231 Blundell Road, Richmond
Aug 13: $1,000,000
Change: – 1200000.00 -55%
A: $1,828,800 (Anybody has more info on this listing?)
1112-5233 Gilbert Road, Richmond
Aug 13: $899,000
Change: – 169000.00 -16%
1979 Cedar Village Crescent, North Vancouver
Aug 13: $998,000
Change: – 190000.00 -16%
102-1135 Windsor Mews, Coquitlam
Aug 13: $549,990
Change: – 98010.00 -15%
A: $555,000 (The condo market is now starting to show near and under-assessed listings)
In what way?
That’s a lot of properties with falling prices in the past month. I don’t have the stats, but I wonder was it like this back in circa 2009?
The interesting thing about this pretentious pile is that it was an attempted flip. The previous owner creamed off $1.7M in less than 2 years. The flipper thought he could do the same for an almost identical amount of money – $1.78M – in even less time. That would assume a bump in price of $3.48M in just a few years – a ridiculous assumption.
The market for houses with indoor pools and gymnasiums is minuscule. The walk score is poor; the orientation of the house is not south. The flipper had way more money than brains. The first seller made out like a bandit. The current idiot is a gambler who lost.
Re. Windsor Mews: I was there today – make fairly regular pilgrimages to the land of “people stinking of fish slime”. The best thing about Coquitlam is that it reinforces how awesome Vancouver is.
Have spent hours in the depressing Henderson Place Mall which is close to Windsor Mews. Am fascinated by the turnover of businesses. The weirdest was a wedding gown store run by Black people. That didn’t last long. Pretty much everyone else in the mall is Chinese, though there is a small number of Koreans – mostly manning the dismal food court. Noodle guy – out of business; ditto the pizza joint. Internet gaming room – dead. People who had a business dream and limited experience – devastated by leases. Funny to see a Donair shop there; and a Persian “Cuisine”. The Donair might make it.
If you see a white face, it’s security, or cleaners. The escalator down hasn’t worked in years.
The biggest problem in the condos/townhouses is sound transmission. People are quickly at each other’s throats. Which works out for the builders of these nasties. Places are sold and resold constantly.
Pets are also permitted. That is not a good thing.
The people I know in Windsor Mews have only been there for a year and are looking to sell. They already bought and sold in another of these buildings – made pretty good money off that one.
#102 is ground floor – seriously undesirable. They paid $400K in 2015. To get near assessed would be a nice paycheck.
A reminder that sociopaths walk among us.
“Growth” that is exclusively from rich immigrants is not sustainable or desirable. “Growth” that depends on high levels of leverage isn’t either.
Healthy growth comes from a broad mixes of sources. You don’t see the middle class going to Vancouver. You don’t see young families moving there in droves. You don’t see many entrepreneurs going there either.
The Economist: “Vancouver no longer North America’s most livable city.”
It never was.
2843 Marine Drive, West Vancouver
Aug 14: $3,788,000
Change: – 592000.00 -14%
A: $4,282,000 (Didn’t sell near assessment)
4088 W 19th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 14: $2,290,000
Change: – 360000.00 -14%
A: $2,809,100 (Didn’t sell under-assessed)
303 4900 Cartier Street, Vancouver
Aug 14: $1,298,000
Change: – 200000.00 -13%
A: $1,522,000 (Didn’t sell under-assessed)
14171 64a Avenue, Surrey
Aug 14: $999,000
Change: – 150000.00 -13%
1195 Sutton Place, West Vancouver
Aug 14: $3,588,000
Change: – 692000.00 -16%
8449 116a Street, Delta
Aug 14: $775,000
Change: – 125000.00 -14%
4511 Beverly Crescent, Vancouver
Aug 14: $6,380,000
Change: – 908000.00 -12%
Marine Drive – an architectural abomination on a magnificent lot on a horrible de facto highway. Would love to tour the property. Would not live there.
W. 19th – To those with wads of cash wanting to build on the West Side this is a pretty good lot – not a prominent location though – way down the hill.
Sutton Pl is still bumped a mil since purchase 2 years ago.
Beverly Crescent is a beautiful house that will cost a fortune to maintain – awkward-shaped lot too. A rare offering.
Marine Drive – No, the road in front of the house is not a “de facto highway”. It’s way too far from the commercial section to have any major traffic issue.
W. 19th – You can’t evaluate the potential of a location, can’t you? This place would be a perfect spot for a money-laundering astronaut family: walking distance to UBC, quiet hood, next to Pacific Spirit park…
Sutton Place – there are no records showing that house was bought 2 years ago. link?
Beverly Crescent – Not everybody likes square lots, especially gardening aficionados. If you can afford this house, maintenance costs are no issue.
Marine Dr. – Right … and that’s not the Horseshoe Bay Blue Bus barrelling down the road. People on our block in fabulous East Van play badminton in the street. Do that on Marine and you’ll be roadkill in two minutes. There is scary traffic on this road.
W. 19th – there’s a big difference between proximity and prominence. We’re at the top of a hill and have panoramic views. 19th is nice, but comparatively claustrophobic.
Weird-shaped lots are always inferior to rectangular – what does gardening have to do with it? That’s just silly.
“People on our block in fabulous East Van play badminton in the street.”
LOL. That’s almost as lame as saying you can windsurf and snowboard on the same day in Vancouver.
Annie is blowing smoke again. First, because he describes East Van as “fabulous”, when in fact it’s the least desirable part of the city. Second, because to play badminton, you need a net.
Reminds me of a kid in our neighborhood when we were growing up, who boasted: “I’m so good at waterskiing I don’t even need a boat.”
Ninja the Toxic Troll – you are a sad nutcase.
Marine Drive – Then if the passing of a bus horrifies you then 95% of the housing stock in the Lower Mainland should suck in your eyes.
W. 19th – Buyers who want a nice view trend towards the condo market, not SFH.
Beverly Crescent – No, rect. lots are not always superior. If you were right, Shaughnessy would have prices similar to Surrey.
Buses pass by 95% of houses? That’s silly.
Detached houses with a view are rare. Buyers don’t “trend” to condos for a view. They buy what’s accessible.
A pie-shaped lot in Shaughnessy is worth a city block in Surrey. If it were rectangular that would be two city blocks.
2701 4808 Hazel Street, Burnaby
Aug 15: $869,000
Change: – 109000.00 -11%
470 Sandbar Place, Delta
Aug 15: $1,148,000
Change: – 150000.00 -12%
28 7428 Southwynde Avenue, Burnaby
Aug 15: $599,000
Change: – 96000.00 -14%
14947 Buena Vista Avenue, White Rock
Aug 15: $2,199,000
Change: – 401000.00 -15%
A: $2,989,900 (Didn’t sell under-assessed :P)
13063 22a Avenue, Surrey
Aug 15: $1,888,000
Change: – 292000.00 -13%
2642 Crescent Drive, Surrey
Aug 15: $1,850,000
Change: – 350000.00 -16%
Where are the listings from Saskatoon?
Some of these places are a stone’s throw from “fabulous” East Van.
Annie getting nervous.
“Best Place on Earth”
Ninja the Toxic Troll – sad sack sour grapes.
When people are willing to walk away from their deposits, the party’s over. Sentiment has shifted. And sentiment is everything.
262 W. 19th.
Can someone help me find the address of this illegal Airbnb? : https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/18916040
I’ll rat them to the city when I’ll have it.
Just curious — what makes it illegal? (not familiar with laws in Vancouver on this…)
New laws in effect are that it needs to be licensed (fee is quite modest) and it needs to be your principle residence. The principle residence requirement is supposed to stop people from taking an apartment building or multiple condo units and running a hotel business, rather than a modestly scaled home business. Enforcement will prove interesting, as the recent North Vancouver situation proves.
262 W. 19th.
Thanks. Appreciate it a lot. Hopefully I’ll trigger a tax sale.
Happy to help.
Just saw this on Twitter. Sounds like they’re taking it seriously?
On the other hand…
The exodus gathers pace. Vancouver has grown in rich satellite families, and shrunk in middle and working class families–the kind of folks that actually sustain a functional community. This trend has and will continue to shred the city’s fabric, and will ultimately make it totally unliveable. One more nail in the RE coffin.
When the market corrects, and it will correct brutally, balance will be restored.
And before you-know-who chimes in with one of his sociopathic “sore losers” quips, let me just say this: F*ck right off, Arnie!
Ninja the Toxic Troll lifts his low brow from his bowl of regurgitated ‘Ol Roy. “Look at that skanky dog,” he says. “I’d like to twerk with that! That’s my style!”
The $20,000.00 wasted on that dog could have paid a lot of rent, or gone towards a mortgage – super dumb move buying a dog – taking away from their childrens future. They’re lucky they found someone willing to rent to them.
Buying a dog is triple-A stupid – a massive waste of cash.
And the other family profiled – who couldn’t make it happen in this awesome city and have to scurry off to Calgary? Guess what – they want a dog. Triple-A stupid.
My beloved, loyal dog is dead. He passed away two months ago, following an accident, at the tender age of two and a half. In his short life, his friendly spirit brought happiness and comfort to our family and all who met him. Helped our kids learn about caretaking and responsibility.
Dogs aren’t for everyone. To be a dog owner, you need to possess a basic level of decency and empathy and concern for someone other than yourself.
This is why I don’t advocate dog ownership for sociopaths like Arnie. If they don’t run from him first, he’s likely to abuse them.
Arnie is beneath dogs, and he knows it. Hence his obsession with the topic.
Ad hominem much?
Talk about illegal airBnBs, this is literally a whole hotel. Wonder if the license number is real. Address? I’ll be looking on my side.
4149 Osler St.
Thanks Ninja 😃
2573 3rd Ave W: bought 1.8 years ago for $3M. Half-scraped – listed at $3.990M. No comparables.
That can’t be right :-). Economics 101: RE prices can go up 60+% in two years but absolutely cannot correct by more than 5% over similar period of time.
In the article, one of the blowhards pontificating about Vancouver real estate has a listing (no, not mama’s boy Saretsky) at 3 – 1483 Beach.
It was bought 8 years 8 months ago for $3.22M.
Currently assessed at $6.55M, it is listed at … wait for it … $8.288M.
On the last Jay Leno Garage show, he interviewed the owner of an old Ferrarri race car. Estimate of the sale price for this car was between $5.5M and $7.5M. Yes, a spread of $2M.
Vancouver is a super premium locale. Within that super premium locale, there are uber desirable, rarely available properties. Charts, averages, medians by putzes of various stripes are of little value.
Real estate is not a commodity; not even in Levittown.
Agents quack maniacally about price drops hoping to influence gullible sellers to list and to list cheap.
Some real gems here from real estate industry bootlicker, Annie.
Are we really comparing Vancouver to Ferraris, now? Just as we did to Swiss bank accounts? LOL.
I’m sure there are gullible buyers out there thinking their crack shack is the real estate equivalent to a high-performance Italian motorcar.
Just don’t remind them that Ferraris crash, are expensive to maintain, and you look like a douchebag driving one.
“Super premium”? “Uber desirable”? Is there a school where they teach this spin? What utter bullsh*t.
You haven’t seen much of the world, have you Annie? Sure, you lived somewhere else before moving to Vancouver (only a non-native could drink the Kool-Aid as enthusiastically as you have). No, I mean REALLY seeing the world. High-end locales. Staying in the them. Living in them. Knowing the folks that live there. Doing business with them. No, no you haven’t. Because if you had, the last thing you would qualify soggy, boring Vancouver as is “super premium”.
And, sorry to say, virtually all real estate absolutely is a commodity. Four walls and a ceiling. That includes your house. Sure, your little coup may have some particular attributes — slightly fewer termites than the one next one over — but at the end of the day, it’s exchangeable. Look at a map of Vancouver. There are a few special places that are outside the commodity category. The rest: row after row after row of little squares, one hardly distinguishable from the next.
Get a grip.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – sad sack sour grapes.
Found a new illegal hotel: https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/20787438
You only need the address to rat it out.
Another one: https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/27811025
504 E. 56th.
3915 W. 13th.
Thanks Ninja 🙂 You’re the man!
What kind of sorcery is this? How you get the address so fast?
Anyway, I doubt the city will do anything but send a strongly worded letter to the owner. Look at how useless they are with the owners who rent their houses to 15+ tenants for $1k each.
I’m good with maps 😉
And, yes, a strongly worded letter is probably all that will come of it.
Like Hans Blix’s warning to Kim Jong Il:
3289 Parker Street, Vancouver
Aug 17: $1,398,000
Change: – 200000.00 -13%
A: $1,528,000 (Under-assessed listings not only a Van West phenomenon anymore. East Van is seeing a growing number of them.)
I’ll just leave this here and back away slowly…
How popular is Vancouver? This popular:
That some people are looking for rooms to rent, or even tents, doesn’t at all show that Vancouver is popular. It merely shows that the market is distorted.
Debt + speculation = artificially high housing prices.
Artificial price gains incent would-be landlords to hold properties off-market (not worth headache, doing “great” financially as bubble expands), while forcing would-be owners to remain renters.
Artificially reduced rental stock + artificially inflated renter pool + poor local economy / dearth of well-paying jobs…
= artificial demand for rooms and tents.
Not proof that Vancouver is popular.
Pretty dumb. For 1000$ you can get an ok apartment in Coquitlam or even Burnaby.
Supply and demand, (oops Globe and Mail is fake biased news not to be trusted think critically):
And more from the CBC – all of sudden, rentals are being built. Supply is starting, but not nearly enough for the demand.
“Hold properties off market.” Not any more.
There’s really nothing in those articles that contradicts the mechanics I outlined above. All they show is that vacancy rates are lower than in the past. Again, I contend that this is due to the factors I described.
The other point made in both the G&M and CBC article is that the problem has been exacerbated by government. Rental stock construction was subsidized, which artificially inflated supply, in turn artificially depressing rents. Unless a developer qualified for the subsidies, making the lower rents the property would collect more palatable, who was going build new stock in that environment? Once again, government meddling created unintended consequences. Nothing new.
Food for thought for a statist like yourself, though.
So the low income local Vancouver speculators are not only working with some of the most expensive price to income real estate in the world, they can afford not only the opportunity cost on the down payment, the mortgage cost, and they can afford to keep it off the rental market. They must be paying the banks in fairy dust.
Regional population increasing 35,000 per year, and how many are living in the suburbs that would love to be in Vancouver as an owner or renter if they could afford to. The reason rents are higher and vacancy rates are lower is demand, despite all the new condo construction and new rental supply finally coming online.
The rental subsidies were withdrawn, same time as condo construction started in earnest. The private sector only feasts on an economic turkey when it has been stuffed with taxpayer dollars, despite their promotion of “free markets” North American business people and corporations are the biggest users of welfare around. For people who hate the government, businesses sure like to use taxpayer resources to get into, stay in and prosper in their businesses. I could only dream of being as statist as a Canadian business.
Homework for Keith: learn the difference between crony-capitalism / corporatism and free-market capitalism.
And btw, population growth for Lower Mainland last year was 1.1%.
That’s lower than it has been in any other year in recent memory, and was below the 1.3% rate for the province as a whole.
Wow. Call your mortgage broker!
Point Grey prices down 13% the past year! And zero detached home sales in Shaughnessy in the month of July. Repeat. Zero. In July.
Not gonna lie, this brought a smile to my face.
Check out the “Metro Vancouver Housing Collapse” group on FB.
Hey Ninja! I have a challenge for you. Can you find the address?: https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/27608260
lolz 1033 w 50th – sushi mura, a&w, pho but didn’t say cyclones
1033 W. 50th.
The significance of falling prices can hardly be overstated.
Speculators have vanished. Credit is contracting. Price discovery is underway. A bottom will be found 60-70% from here.
This started 1-2 years ago, and is gathering steam.
The party’s over and the hangover is just starting to set in. It’s gonna be a doozy.
My neighbour has been doing BnB for years. Has only been an issue a few times: idiot smokers on the deck; a yappy dog; an idiot who left his vehicle idling for ten minutes.
I prefer the energy tourists bring to our street rather than renters; and they bring cash into our economy. There have been all colours ages and ethnicities. Let them go back and boost this great city to their friends. They’ll come and spend more money.
It’s better than those horrible tiny subterranean illegal “second suites”. Those just breed depressive whiners
Annie prefers party-seeking foreigners to long-term renters who might actually form part of the local community. Some tourism is fine, don’t get me wrong. But a revolving door of strangers is not my idea of a neighborhood.
Oh, and skin colour doesn’t matter. Unless you’re racist.
Speaking of depressive whiners.
Imagine getting stuck with Ninja the Toxic Troll in your rental. He sneaks in his Shitzu and blasts twerking music all night. You can’t evict him because the “suite” is illegal.
1428 King Edward W: an atrocious high-traffic location; no view; not south-facing. Bought 2014 for $3.58M. Assessed @ $7.189M. Listed @ $9.98M. In less than four years they think they’ll make $6.4M? $4,408.00/day for four years? WTF. Unless you can scrape it and put up a tower, it does not compute.
Significant premium over assessed value, sold this year.
Backs onto Trout Lake – no surprise.
Aspiring realtors Keith and Annie find a random example of black in a sea of red. How many hours did it take?
This shack of a house, and the monstrosity next-door, will sell for 400K at market bottom.
Aspiring realtor? I knew you had a sense of humor somewhere. It was found in passing naturally, I don’t have access to sales information. Let’s double the sample size with a famous example from the west side, where single family homes are down 20% from the peak. This one sold over assessed value as well. Location matters, as an aspiring realtor might say.
Look, they overinflated their asking price and still didn’t shoot themselves in the foot.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – sad sack sour grapes. Just likes the view of his landlord’s feet.
Starbucks barista Arnie rehearsing here for a job as a used house salesman.
Too bad there are an estimated 90,000 realtors in Canada–many out of work as a result of the current downturn, many more to be jobless soon.
Not a smart move, Arnie.
Stick to serving lattes.
In the countryside where I grew up, I recall a dog getting whacked by a car. It wailed piteously at the feet of its owner, biting at its bleeding leg.
Did he rush it to a vet to turn it into another one of those 3-legged dogs – symbols of irresponsible owners. No, he went into his house, brought out a rifle and, bang, problem solved.
The sad part of the story is that, to my knowledge, he didn’t utilize this animal protein; as do a quarter of a million Swiss.
Hope you honoured your twerky shitzu in a similar manner.
Little-known fact: About 1% of the population is psychopathic. That’s a lot.
This “man”, Arnie, is one of them. Takes pleasure in animal suffering.
In life, these people are to be avoided. Keep yourself away from them. Your pets, too. And, above all, your children.
Pro tip: assessed “values” are meaningless as indicators of value.
They simply reflect what people have been willing to pay recently.
It doesn’t matter that some dude paid “x” for a house down the street a few months ago. What matters is what someone will be willing to pay in the future.
And, over time, what people are willing to pay CHANGES. A lot.
Sentiment changes. Incomes change. Interest rates change. The availability of credit changes. Areas come in and out of favour. Styles change. Buildings age. The number of sellers and buyers and their demographic and socioeconomic circumstances… change. The list goes on.
Change, folks. The one constant in life.
Perfect for Annie:
– Revolving door of Airbnb customers, bringing lots of “energy”.
– Located in “fabulous” East Van.
Ninja the Toxic Troll feels remorse for letting his shitzu buddy have an “accident”. Feels worse that he didn’t pay the vet to have it fixed. He realizes he could have gone on BGT with his three-legged dog twerking act. He had thoughts of fame. Instead he twerks lonely and alone – in this achingly beautiful wonderful city. BPOE.
My dog… a better soul than many a man. Fought hard.
As for me… born and raised in Vancouver. Know the place like only a native can. Hence my interest.
But live there? You couldn’t pay me to. Not these days.
I’ve left and won’t be going back.
A lot of smart people have done the same. Opportunities elsewhere are better in virtually every field — except real estate pumping, subprime lending, tax evasion, securities fraud, money laundering, and drug trafficking. Vancouver has us beat in those areas. BPOE, for sure.
Alas, it will all end. The inevitable popping of the bubble will restore some balance. Some sanity. And destroy a lot of egos. It will hurt, but people will adjust. It will be healthy.
Arnie? He’ll still be a psycho, begging for tips at the local Starbucks. Throw him a few pennies.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – wondering what happened with his life. Lashing out with ‘Ol Roy bile.
1409 38th Ave W: scraper bought almost 5 years ago for $2.3M. With new-build – assessed at $4.644M. Listed at $8.99M. Horrible house, but like the idea of “censored toilets” – whatever that is. Good location; south-facing, quiet, but no Skytrain. No thanks. Crazy money. Oh, and an elevator – going for the decrepit but rich market.
You should go for your realtor license, Annie. Better than serving lattes. You could tell people all about bogs and SkyTrains. Really indulge your obsession. You’ll be a hit.
Just one problem. No one is actually worried about bogs.
Nor do most folks see proximity to the SkyTrain as an asset. Who wants to see that eyesore, and the losers riding it?
Oh well. Starsucks ain’t such a bad option, after all.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – only your pathetic dog found you interesting.
Bold prediction at the time, but the market said no.
Realtor-in-training Keith thinks that, because a prediction was wrong at a certain time in the past, it will forever remain wrong in the future. That’s about the dumbest logic I’ve ever heard.
It’s like looking at an airplane with mechanical wear and saying, “well, it hasn’t crashed yet…”.
Many market downturns (and other, non-market events, for that matter), have been predicted over the years. Of course they haven’t all panned out. No one has a crystal ball. That doesn’t mean the reasoning on which they’re based should be jettisoned.
And that’s the key: Is the reasoning sound?
(Btw, for every market downturn that has been predicted, someone else has predicted the opposite. Recall the stock market pundits circa 1999?)
Today there are very few compelling arguments to be made in favor of renewed price gains. There are, however, many compelling reasons for which prices could fall (continue falling, I should say). I won’t go into them right now; there are too many to list.
Throwing mud at skeptics in this way is both shallow and foolhardy. You don’t have to agree with them, but a critical thinker considers all perspectives.
It’s great as a marketing gimmick, though.
And, no, the market did not say “no”.
The government did.
With unprecedented, sustained emergency-level interest rates.
With an idle if not encouraging stance on record household indebtedness.
With continued and strengthened subsidies to lenders and homeowners.
With a blind-eye turned to rampant speculation, subprime lending, money laundering, and tax evasion.
Everything that could be done to inflate housing… was done.
It’s taken a few years, but they’ve finally run out of ammunition.
Since you respond to every single one of my posts, what on earth makes you think I am bullish on real estate. I have posted links from both the bull and bear camps many times. I have also said that predicting the market is a mugs game, primarily because real estate is liquidity and interest rate sensitive. Warren Buffett doesn’t try to predict interest rates or other macro factors, so why anyone less intelligent or accomplished would even try is beyond me. Garth Turner is an intelligent and highly accomplished individual as a businessman and politician, and his prediction was wrong. It wasn’t wrong at a certain time, he repeated it dozens of times in the last twelve years. It’s not throwing mud to say that his prediction failed, it’s pointing out how difficult it is to call markets, even for people with knowledge and access to data and information. You should read and watch The Big Short to understand how few people made money from a serious market asymmetry.
Government has introduced the stress test, which has reduced liquidity and interest rates have risen. The foreign buyers tax has been increased. The market has not responded in unison yet, with condos and townhouses on a tear in the last year. I am as surprised as anyone at the length and strength of the Vancouver real estate market, but maybe the current weakness on the West side of the single detached market is one of the canaries in the mine. Or the recall campaigns against David Eby and a few others will succeed, the B.C. Liberals will take control of the government, and a series of policies will be enacted that set the bull running again. Who knows.
I am bullish on real estate ownership if it matches your personal circumstances and you understand all the risks and benefits. People who bought a house in Toronto in 1992 had to stay in it until 2005, for prices to recover to the point they purchased at, net of inflation. You can be underwater on real estate for a long time. Counting on a single asset in a particular market as a store of wealth, which is the strategy of far too many Canadians, is risky. If the market crashes to the extent that you have predicted, there will be dire consequences for many as you have pointed out, and opportunity for a very few. Markets can stay irrational longer than you can stay liquid. People who held off buying in 2006, their children are now ready to graduate high school. Hopefully they found a stable rental situation in a neighborhood with good schools, and invested their down payment capital wisely.
Condo prices now falling like rocks.
It seems to bother you that I respond to your posts. If that’s true, not sure what you were expecting. The whole point of this blog is to engage in debate / conversation. Otherwise it would be a private diary.
It’s true you can’t reliably predict interest rates. And it’s also true that markets can stay irrational longer than you can stay liquid. Neither of those truths, however, are reasons to throw in the towel on any sort of attempt at market appraisal, and jump into the fray without a care. There is a place for reasoned analysis in one’s decision-making, however uncertain it may be.
Buffett, rightly, doesn’t make guesses about interest rates, economic growth rates, etc. But he sure knows an overpriced market when he sees one. You will have noticed he has made precious few investments the last few years, despite sitting on a mountain of cash. Speaks volumes.
As far as your stance. If you are a not a bull, or a bear, what are you? A flip-flopper? That’s boring. It’s better to have some conviction in your views. You might be wrong, but at least you’ll be interesting. No one wants to hear cautious, “on-the-other-hand” arguments. There is too much information flying at people, from too many sources, to make half-stances remotely compelling. Decisions need to me made.
That was the first lesson taught to me when I worked as an investment writer: Clearly tell the reader what you think, and why, with the full force of your reasoning. Someone else can make the other case, with equal energy, and the reader can then make us his mind for himself.
It doesn’t bother me that you respond to my posts, I don’t like it when you get it wrong. I’m not a bull, I’m not a bear, I’m a man who doesn’t have to care. When I bought, it was to own real estate in the long run. The expected long run rate of return on real estate is at the rate of inflation. Better return than cash, and higher than working for wages. In the shorter run, the returns will vary. Unpredictably. I’m not in the market to buy or sell at this time.
Real estate equity is part of a strategy for surviving old age. It’s part of a balanced set of assets for the middle class. On average, homeowners have 30x the net worth of renters. Some people took Garth’s column to heart and wallet back in 2006, and decided to wait for a crash. Many of those were shut out of the market waiting for it to crash. If you can’t get in now, no matter for resourceful people, although renting seems to be a worse option than it used to be for the majority. If you can afford it at this point in time, then be prepared to own for a complete market cycle, which can be a very long time or be comfortable with the risk waiting for a major crash and getting that timing wrong.
Buffett is willing to make investments with a margin of safety, he cannot deploy billions in the public markets the way he used to work in the past. He is on record saying that if he was working with a million dollars today, he is confident he would be getting returns in the 50% range. He is working in the market buying privately owned companies that fit his criteria in the multi billion dollar range, but there aren’t a lot on the market, for obvious reasons. When he buys a profitable company for cash, he doesn’t have to worry about interest rates unless it’s an interest rate sensitive company nor the general economy if it has been around for decades.
To blindly post links to articles on either the bull or bear camp seems to lack the critical thinking you keep calling for, and the objectivity you crave. Blindly ignoring and disparaging the opinions of others just because it’s an opposite point of view is hardly defensible. What I post is simply the opinion, sometimes biased and self-serving of a source that I find interesting or informative. The reader can make his mind up for himself as to their value to the discussion. Sometimes bullish, sometimes bearish.
My decision on Vancouver real estate. I voted with my money. I own real estate, along with a balanced portfolio of investments that are unrelated to the value of Vancouver real estate. My prediction of the Vancouver real estate market in the future: It will vary. If it continues to go up, even modestly I will prosper with those increases. If it crashes to the extent of your prediction, I will go bargain hunting. It will be part of my net worth, but I won’t live or die over its future valuation, if it crashes 65% I will not lose sleep. Most people in Canada will be far worse off than me. I will continue to post links to things that I find interesting, and vreaa can block me if they choose.
It bothers you that I get it wrong, does it? Well, let me point out a few points that you have gotten deeply wrong:
– “On average, homeowners have 30x the net worth of renters.” This is the perfect example of a lack of critical thinking. For one thing, you have confused correlation with causation. For another, you have not adjusted for age. That makes this comparison apples-to-oranges, i.e. meaningless. The average homeowner is going to be relatively old, and will thus have had relatively more years over which to acquire wealth. The average renter is going to be relatively young, with correspondingly fewer wealth-building years behind him.
– Garth may have been “wrong” in his prediction, but his reasoning was sound. It still is. And when it comes to appraising the future, reasoning is all we have. Otherwise it’s just throwing darts.
– “Buffett is on record saying that if he was working with a million dollars today, he is confident he would be getting returns in the 50% range.” That statement is many, many years old. More recently, Buffett has said that even mediocre businesses are selling at unattractive prices. And while it’s true that he is constrained by the large sums of capital he manages, it’s also true that he has found truly massive investment opportunities in the past. He hasn’t found any recently. He has never been sitting on so much cash. And there are a lot of very large businesses he could be buying, if he wanted to. But he isn’t. He knows this market is richly-priced and he’s following his own famous advice: Be fearful when others are greedy.
– “My prediction of the Vancouver real estate market in the future: It will vary.” That is a non-prediction. A copout. It’s useless. Of course the market will vary; all markets do. It’s like saying temperatures will vary. No one cares. Again, have some conviction.
And here’s your biggest mistake:
You speak as if you occupy some sort noble middle ground, above the fray, poised to benefit no matter which direction the market takes (doubtful). The problem isn’t that you’re smug — you clearly are. The problem is that you grant the ‘bull’ camp false legitimacy. You speak of one camp and the other as if they were equally valid.
And yet, I have seen precious little in the way of a convincing bull case. In order to grant it equal ground, you must establish its credibility. You must set forth logically sound, evidence-based, historically-grounded arguments as to why price declines will reverse.
Where are these arguments, pray tell? I haven’t seen them from you, nor anyone. Meanwhile, I and others have identified numerous risks and headwinds in the months and years to come–the ‘bear case’. Where is the bull case.
As for vreaa “blocking” you, don’t play victim. Doesn’t look good.
Speaking of Buffett:
The other 38% are realtors, bankers, speculators, and “investors” who’ve piled everything they have (and then some) into a single asset.
PH02 1011 Cordova: assessed at $25.677M. Listed at $34.995M.
1243 Chartwell Pl: assessed at $12.458M. Listed at $39.9M.
Selling price, not listing price, relevant.
Mind the needles.
For heroin addicts.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – a prisoner in a mental asylum of his own making.
6821 Heather Street, Vancouver
Aug 27: $3,390,000
Change: – 500000.00 -13%
95 E 42nd Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 27: $1,699,000
Change: – 200000.00 -11%
A: $1,925,300 ( Didn’t sell under-assessed :P)
1849 W 35th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 24: $6,180,000
Change: – 770000.00 -11%
3768 W Broadway, Vancouver
Aug 23: $2,998,000
Change: – 800000.00 -21%
139 E 24th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 22: $1,988,000
Change: – 650000.00 -25%
4346 Knight Street, Vancouver
Aug 22: $899,000
Change: – 189000.00 -17%
A: $1,117,000 ( Didn’t sell under-assessed :P)
749 E 39th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 22: $1,299,000
Change: – 150000.00 -10%
305 4078 Knight Street, Vancouver
Aug 22: $675,799
Change: – 74001.00 -10%
2776 E 25th Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 27: $1,198,000
Change: – 100000.00 -8%
A: $1,316,800 ( Didn’t sell under-assessed :P)
2305 Ferndale Street, Vancouver
Aug 27: $998,000
Change: – 90000.00 -8%
A: $1,201,300 ( It seems that -10% Assessment is the new starting price for East Van 🙂 )
1951 E 3rd Avenue, Vancouver
Aug 24: $1,450,000
Change: – 249000.00 -15%
In a bizarre twist, East Van seems to be hurting more than the westside. The price drops seem to be more desperate. You don’t see listings rotting with the same price for months on end.
Perhaps in general, people on the west side have better finances to hold out longer???
The interesting listing above is 1951 3rd Ave E. Actually, it’s the property next to it at 1957. It caught my eye a few years ago as a good use of land, but forgot where I’d seen it, so thumbs up for inadvertently helping me find it again.
Why would two adjacent properties of equal lot size differ in value by more than a factor of two? 1957 is assessed at $3.698M. Someone else saw the value in it and bought it in 2016 for $3.015M.
This is a rare case of the building being worth more than a the land – and it was built in 1912. This old timer rowhouse straddles the lot lengthwise well into city-owned land. It’s big. You can’t build like that anymore. It’s grandfathered in.
1951 is left like a little pipsqueak dominated by this large structure. This nadir of Vancouver Specdom with its atrocious layout, cheap construction, and pink bedroom would be a downer to live in.
Chinese special at 1951, and an imposing yet dull dance-hall next to it. So what if it’s grandfathered. It’s atrocious. Both will sell for <1m at market bottom.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – the real estate pipsqueak piping up. It’s not a dance hall – it’s rowhouses.
Looks like a dance hall. Or cafeteria. Or gymnasium. Whatever it is, it’s awful.
When pigs fly.
And this is only the very beginning!
Agree. 2019 will be very interesting to watch.
How come companies like this don’t get shut down?: https://www.hostgenius.ca/packages-services
Bogus Ben Rabid Rabidoux – what kind of an idiot pays attention to this putz.
The numbers don’t lie.
Yes, Ninja the Toxic Troll is the kind of idiot that pays attention to Bogus Ben Rabid Rabidoux.
I pay attention to the data, and they’re not looking good. Sales have plummeted, and prices are following.
Forget Rabidoux. This is now widespread knowledge to all whose heads aren’t firmly up their own a*ss.
Can you provide compelling evidence to the contrary?
No, you can’t.
This is the beginning of an historic, multi-year real estate crash, the twin epicenters of which are Vancouver and Toronto, and it’s impact will be felt countrywide.
Have you no dignity? No sense of honesty? Only someone lacking in self-respect could lie to himself so.
The only country facing a crisis comparable if not worse to Canada’s is Australia. And their party is over, too.
By the way, every Canadian should read Hilliard MacBeth. And take his advice.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – god you’re clueless. Better stock up for the zombie apocalypse.
Hey Annie, perhaps you could string together a semi-thoughtful argument for once? I know it’s hard, with all those lattes to serve. Maybe while on your break.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – looking for a pen pal – ever alert for zombies and flying pigs.
Found another illegal hotel: https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/18450192
The host is dumb enough to clearly admit it:
“This is a two-suite home. The main home has four bedrooms (one bedroom is an attic with two floor mattresses, which is suitable for kids or teens). The garden suite has three bedrooms. The whole house can sleep 13 or 14 comfortably. Please note that there is no access between the suites from inside the house; access is via backyard stairs. You can rent the suites either separately or together for a big group. For separate rental and for more info on each suite please see https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/11920359 and https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/18425269.”
This underscores the hyper-desirability of Vancouver as a place to visit and live. If this rental was in Saskatoon, or Moncton, or in any of hundreds of other Canadian cities, it wouldn’t be an issue because people wouldn’t go.
Vancouver is in its exuberant adolescence. The spectacular growth we’ve witnessed, unless your head is up your orifice trying to avoid low-flying pigs, is just the beginning.
This city is awesome.
Aspiring realtor Annie is rehearsing his sales lines for when he becomes a used house salesman. Can’t wait to leave behind the lattes.
Let’s have a look at his claim that Vancouver is “awesome” and “hyper-desirable”.
If this were true, why would sales and prices be falling so steeply?
Why would Vancouver’s population growth lag that of the province?
What “growth” has there been, come to think of it, other than that fueled by cheap credit (unsustainable)?
Rates of immigration growth, as published by BC Stats, have been dropping consistently in recent years. Why aren’t they growing, as they would if Annie’s claim were correct?
And why would so many people leaving?
I look forward to Annie’s thoughtful responses to each of these questions.
Don’t get me wrong: Vancouver is an okay town. Not because of the people or culture or architecture or business opportunities or quality of universities or global relevance, but because it is near to some nature and decent recreational attractions.
When the market has fallen by two-thirds — and there is little doubt it will — Vancouver’s attractiveness will grow because it will be priced in line with the actual value it offers.
Can someone help me find the address?
401 55th Ave E: Little India. Rodent lists property as “custom”. No, it’s a common Van Spec Dreck – ugly and atrocious layout – dumb as a coffered ceiling. Sikh aesthetic – including multiple pictures of religious leaders and the Golden Temple. This is staging? An utterly unappealing property.
And yet “this city is awesome.”
Ninja the Toxic Troll is excited when he sees a bubble – then deflated when he realizes it’s his prostate.
Yeah, that’s about a thoughtful a reply as I was expecting from Annie.
Makes claims, can’t back ’em up.
No cojones on this “man”.
1637 Grant: half-a-house – built in 2005: bought for $780K 8 years ago. Assessed at $1.23M. Listed at $1.788M. Owners would like to say they made a million in 8 years while living there. Has a very long wall with a large crappy piece of art; a cramped eat-in kitchen with a view of the neighbour’s wall. Lots of stairs to cut into square footage. And, bonus, a rental suite with a view of the landlord’s feet, for those who have played at life and lost.
7112 Beechwood – adjacent to the 3 year nightmare at 7084 Beechwood – site of the pierced aquifer that spewed a billion litres of water. Neighbours will be watching this listing vigilantly – ready like a bunch of rich rats to desert the area.
Unbelievably, it’s listed over a million over assessed. If it sells anywhere near this, there will be a flood of properties put up for sale.
Bought for $3.5M just 7 years ago, they hope to sell for $3M extra.
And what are the odds that some real estate rodent is going to inform prospects what happened here.
The area is stigmatized.
5638 Crown St: bought 4 years ago for $3,388,571. – a super trickster number. Listed at $5.58M. In four years? Seriously?
1491 46th Ave W: a living hell address adjacent to the traffic madness of Granville St. Assessed at $3.594M. Listed at $5.588M. Living hell.
At least two of these three lots have had new houses built on them since last sale, which in the recent market would account for expectation of a rise of $1-1.5 million in value. I imagine that the assessment of 1491 W. 46th doesn’t take account of its new house.
“Unbelievably, it’s listed a million over assessed.” Well, I believe it. It’s a quiet neighbourhood, unlikely to confront significant densification in the foreseeable future, and it’s Laundromat Central. These are the kinds of adventures that are business as usual in an environment of “hyperdesirability” — for something.
How can a house sitting on Granville St. be in a quiet neighbourhood? It’s 24hr noise. Living hell.
You’re right on the bump in price on 46th at Granville due to new construction, but not the other two. They were built earlier.
Crown St. built 2014; sold for 3.4 million “four years ago” –before or after build? The house that’s listed a million over assessed is the one on Beechwood, which is indeed a quiet neighbourhood. In any case, I’m mystified by your general agenda; it seems like only you are allowed to say that prices are irrational. Plus, I don’t think it’s news that Shaughnessy includes some very busy streets; nevertheless it is traditionally one of the highest-priced parts of the city. If you like your own neighbourhood better, I’m happy for you, but that’s not “the market.”
Crown was built in 2013 – sold two years later for the above figure – now massively bumped.
Beechwood is a quiet neighbourhood – now that all the remediation equipment is gone. I’ve been there many times.
My agenda? To point out bullshit, bogs, doublespeak, trickery.
I’m not some mama’s boy putz chart maker trying to make a name for myself and score a few listings in the process.
I’m not some doomsday dick selling books, or financial services and life insurance.
I know more than most about construction, architecture, real estate, and this great city.
I like to share my insights. It pisses of agents, of course, and Ninja the Toxic Troll, but my posts aren’t directed at him.
There’s a huge industry trying to sell you stuff. My agenda – to help people see clearly – whether it’s kitchen layout; poor locations; ridiculous prices.
What is “the market”?
I drill down to actual properties – physical addresses.
Pretty much the only guy I’d listen to is Ozzie Jurock – and I still wouldn’t give him two cents.
“The market” is not a myth but consists of broad trends in prices, of what people will buy and sell for. Prices of individual properties will be influenced by recent “comparables,” in terms of location, size, age, etc. Within that market, individual opinions about particular properties will vary, but that’s probably not enough to affect the market. If I had $5-6 million to spend, I would spend it on something other than one of those houses, but given general trends, I’m not surprised that people are asking that much. We’ll have to see what they actually sell for. I’m just honestly baffled by your tendency to complain about so many specific properties for sale yet also insist that this is a “great city.”
Realtor’s listing says Crown St. house was built in 2014. But of course, he/she is a rodent.
It is true that houses were and are built without regard for water issues, such as bogs and underground streams. But is there any history of this affecting the prices of those houses? Is it a factor in the market?
Canis is right. Individual values may vary according to a property’s particular features, but ALL are subject to broader market forces. The availability of credit, income levels, levels of household formation, prevailing buyer/seller sentiment, the list goes on. These are all-important.
Reducing your “analysis” to a single property is akin to studying a tree without considering the soil, sun, wind, water, temperature, etc. of the forest in which it grows.
Mount Pleasant is partly built on an old swamp. This article gives a good history, along with the consequences today.
Thank Keith — this is interesting and illuminating. Meanwhile, City Council is about to re-juice the speculative frenzy and demolitions:
Let ‘er rip, boys!!!! Game on!
How is it your takeaway that the city is going to re-juice the speculative frenzy? I didn’t get that from the article at all. What I did get is that growth in housing supply has greatly exceeded population growth. The issue seems to be that unjustified construction growth = unjustified costs re: water, sewage, etc.
That may be right:
But the City Council’s proposed rezoning seems, on the surface at least, to be a way to turn every street into Cambie Street.
List price ≠ value.
Hard to grasp for the intellectually challenged. Simple for the rest of us.
Ninja the Toxic Troll takes a break from his visual prostate examination.
Angry Arnie watching helplessly as his equity evaporates. Maybe a round of street badminton would cheer him up.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – looking for a pen pal.
For all you chart-lovers out there.
You can’t blame the weather on this… 🙂
Another illegal hotel, quite hard to find the address: https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/14264768
The moronic host even admits it: “I own the house next door and my aunt lives right behind me. We are always around if need be.”
Looks like a McMansion. Hideous.
I will find it. And the others. But can’t now — too busy.
Are you reporting these guys? Anything come of it, you think?
I got some comments from the city regarding previous complaints. They seem completely overwhelmed so it’ll take time to send out fines.
Back to the Tea Swamp … there’s an unusual listing at 3636 St. George – a modern architect-designed building on a toothpick lot – 20’ x 198’, with no laneway. It’s sandwiched and shoehorned into this afterthought of a lot.
Why, one might ask, does such an odd lot exist? One might also wonder why there is no basement – why .6 rather than the usual .7 FSR?
Could it be because there is a stream that runs all the way down St George from under Charles Tupper School to 15th, where it veers off at St Joseph’s Hospital. The stream starts way up high at Mountainview Cemetery and terminates at the False Creek Flats. Busy beavers from way back dammed the area and created the massive bog that still plagues the area.
This property was bought 16 years ago for $246K and sold 12 years later for $1.1M. Now, it’s offered for 3 mil. That’s one million per bedroom – with no mortgage helper; no view unless they dig up the street and daylight the stream; no Skytrain.
A lot of today’s “wealth” is illusory and will collapse like a house of cards.
Could you make a post regarding Vancouver’s Illegal hotels?
Here’s what’s remaining now: https://www.airbnb.ca/s/Vancouver–BC/homes?refinement_paths%5B%5D=%2Fhomes&query=Vancouver%2C%20BC&min_bedrooms=5&room_types%5B%5D=Entire%20home%2Fapt&map_toggle=true&allow_override%5B%5D=&checkin=2018-10-23&checkout=2018-10-27&zoom=12&search_by_map=true&sw_lat=49.197383638327&sw_lng=-123.21913083726144&ne_lat=49.30367085806849&ne_lng=-123.08244159726973&s_tag=nSRSDl3O
Mr Magoo and his sidekick McBarker – hot on the trails of the evildoers.
dood … https://tinyurl.com/y74gpp4q … btw, not ndp … pb has always been white collar criminals foreign and domestic … real bubbles collapse when the fuel is exhausted and china is blowing up … and will be for a while … the economic miracle isn’t … it was just mao pulling 1/4 of the ww workforce off to slave away in rice paddies until that almost collapsed … then, they reintegrated dirt poor labor for a while … but the model of “show me how to do something so i can co-opt former slaves to do it for cheaper and lend you money to buy it from me” can only get so far
Yes, the realtor is wrong. Not NDP. Just a gasbag bubble imploding on its own. At least he’s frank, I’ll give him that. Hilarious and predictable to see realtorspeak go from upbeat to depressed. Prospects for employment hawking used houses is not good. Too much competition. Market tanking. Take heed aspiring realtors.
I think vreaa is on an extended hiatus. Never before have so many comments accumulated on a single post — even with Arnie’s spam.
i like to think he/she found a way to short local ppty … so, wayyy too busy for this
i am going short the whole country.
mad max a glimmer of hope.
reports of my death exaggerated
and watchin’ the river flow…
(something does appear to be happening to the housing market..)
will post something soonish..
vreaa kicking back, taking in the spectacle.
i guess it’s not darts … or we’d have a new round already at 501
Another chart worthy of framing:
i choose ‘party over’.. final answer
2728 Turner: bought 2 years ago for $1.4M. Scraped and replaced with “modern” – now listed at: $2.528M.
Rare video of a couple of hipsters with fancy beards – the builder and “designer”, who have never cooked a meal, or washed a dish, wanking on about design.
This house is the antithesis of good design – truly awful – dysfunctional.
Listing indicates the builder won an award by a self serving industry lapdog. It wasn’t for this turkey – stunningly bad design – an embarrassment.
Good location though – convenient – level lot – south-facing – not overwhelmed by shade trees.
9280 Boyd Court, Richmond
Sep 6: $1,990,000
Change: – 738000.00 -27%
A: $2,347,000 (Flipper bought it 1.7mil in 2015, -200k and it’s a burn)
7540 No. 2 Road, Richmond
Sep 5: $1,950,000
Change: – 447588.00 -19%
3251 Douglas Crescent, Richmond
Sep 4: $828,000
Change: – 221000.00 -21%
A: $1,014,800 (Cute little house)
West Vancouver edition:
3050 Spencer Drive, West Vancouver
Sep 6: $3,598,000
Change: – 390000.00 -10%
A: $4,531,000 (Flipper f$$ked big time. Bought 4.35 mil$ in Feb-2017. This could easily lead to 1,000,000/year loss. Wouldn’t be surprised if this house has a fire “accident”.)
1482 Chippendale Road, West Vancouver
Sep 6: $5,998,000
Change: – 1001000.00 -14%
1055 Elveden Row, West Vancouver
Sep 6: $2,598,000
Change: – 400000.00 -13%
933 Eyremount Drive, West Vancouver
Sep 5: $3,998,000
Change: – 892000.00 -18%
6465 Wellington Avenue, West Vancouver
Sep 4: $1,898,800
Change: – 370000.00 -16%
4741 Rutland Road, West Vancouver
Sep 4: $1,998,000
Change: – 490000.00 -20%
The Elveden listing is fascinating. I used to be curious about this area because of the lake, but never managed to get up there to have a look. Small wonder – it has a walk/bike score of 4/8. Nobody passes by – just the bears. Funny to see snow on the ground in the listing video.
This country estate is the boonies. The per sq/ft land cost is $190. – half of Vancouver. And should one decide to build/add on, the site development costs would be monumental.
How much would you have to pay contractors to drive up that mountain? Who would want to live there besides elves and sherpas?
boonies? … puh-leez! … it’s british ppties = views + limited access for peons … ever notice super expensive crap like all underground utilities
Arnie can’t comprehend how anyone could have tastes different than his own.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – connoisseur of ‘Ol Roy.
Douglas Crescent is a scraper on a pie-shaped lot facing a dreaded T, on an undesirable cul de sac, at the airport. Unless there are plans to flatten Burkeville to build a new runway, this property is not a good idea.
Latest job numbers are brutal. BRUTAL. What an absolute dumpster fire of a government we have.
One more nail in the real estate coffin.
Stats from anther blog:
3507 MONMOUTH AVE, assessed 1.715, listed 1.599, sold 1.550
3289 PARKER ST, assessed 1.528, listed 1.398, sold 1.380
637 20TH AVE E, assessed 1.848, listed 1.797, sold 1.529
2305 FERNDALE ST, assessed 1.201, listed 1.088, sold 980K
2171 36TH AVE E, assessed 1.207, listed 1.100, sold 975K
5226 BLENHEIM ST, assessed 3.272, listed 3.299, sold 2.900 (11% below assessed)
6607 CYPRESS ST, assessed 4.455, listed 4.200, sold 3.765 (15% below)
1366 LABURNUM ST, assessed 3.149, listed 3.098, sold 2.800 (11% below)
741 61ST AVE W, assessed 3.003, listed 3.090, sold 2.690 (10% below)
3896 50TH AVE W, assessed 3.985, listed 3.588, sold 3.300 (17% below)
3033 Spuraway Avenue, Coquitlam
Sep 6: $978,800
Change: – 221100.00 -18%
5 Aspen Court, Port Moody
Sep 6: $1,327,880
Change: – 137120.00 -9%
830 Baker Drive, Coquitlam
Sep 6: $1,338,000
Change: – 150000.00 -10%
1068 Hull Court, Coquitlam
Sep 6: $998,000
Change: – 100000.00 -9%
3001 1178 Heffley Crescent, Coquitlam
Sep 5: $599,000
Change: – 69000.00 -10%
A: $604,000 ( Flipper bought Sep 2017 for 573k . He/She will be barely even if sold at price.)
Monmouth – good deal even though it flanks Payne St – could become part of an assembly and double the buyer’s money. Looks like it was bought from a dead person.
Parker – not an appealing area; on the Boundary Road Bog; TransCan noise penetrates 24/7. Bought for $955K four years ago, so they waltzed off with over four hundred large after living there. Who wouldn’t take that deal.
20th Ave – Little India. Google the street – see the crack in the middle? Bog.
Bought just over 8 years ago for $652K, that’s pushing $900K profit while having a house to live in. Who wouldn’t take that deal.
Ferndale – micro lot in a super convenient area. Better than strata hell. Bought in 1984 for $56,500. Presumably the seller is not going to go crazy with his/her windfall.
2171 36th E: worth googling. When was the last time you saw tires buried in the ground to make a fence? Depressing area – lot is small, has no lane, and faces a T. A builder with a sharp pencil might make a few bucks off this scraper, but most wouldn’t bother. Bought for just over a mil 3 years ago, it gave the buyer a place to live. To rent a house, if you can find one, is going to cost you, what, pretty much 40K a year, so there’s little money made or lost on this deal.
Really? Let’s do the math:
Cost of Renting
40k/year*2 years = 80,000$
Cost of Buying
Loss of Value = 1,030,000-975,000 = 55,000$
TPP = 17,500$
Realtor fees = ~25,000$ (conservative estimate)
Taxes = ~5,000$ for 2 years (very conservative estimate)
Total = 102,500$
So the pour schmuck would have been 22,500$ better off if he had rented. And that’s assuming that the house was paid cash, no mortgage at all! What do you think? Your amygdala can react properly with this information?
+ opportunity cost … 90-day USTs pay 2% essentially risk free ex-inflation
Isn’t also true that (on average) even if someone makes a profit on a sale, most will just plow the profit to buying another overpriced house in the city with a similar price gain? So, you’re not really making any profit.
Do you live in Vancouver? Did you know that your house could get sucked into the ground at any moment, along with your family and dearest possessions?
Don’t be tricked by the fact that literally no one is worried about bogs.
They’re real. And they’re coming.
Only a qualified bog professional can save you.
Call today for a free consultation!
Only Ninja the Toxic Troll always objects and has a hissy fit. Very peculiar that.
Bog consulting. Could be a way out of barista boredom.
3896 50th Ave W – a steal @ $211/sq ft. with an RS 6 zoning and park setting. Looks like the listing photos were taken by a drunk monkey – deliberately bad.
southlands – ack! … seems an apt sentiment for all the haunts … https://tinyurl.com/h3cmrq2
1050 King Georges Way: bought as a scraper 5 years ago for $2.4M. Ridiculous new-build listed at $16.888M. Looking for a Persian buyer that yanked a pile of cash out of Iran; or maybe a Russian mafioso; African despots would find it too cold. It would be interesting to know who bought this property and orchestrated the build. It takes deep pockets to pull this off. And who wants this mausoleum.
Because we all know that Vancouver is the number one choice for global magnates and oligarchs. Not London, not Paris, not New York, not San Francisco, not Hong Kong.
Get over yourself. You live in a mid-tier city of mid-tier global relevance.
A village by the sea.
Ninja the Toxic Troll – full of himself – revels in his ignorance as he kneels at the feet of a “financial services” toad like “Shilliard” Hilliard Macbeth, or “Gloomy” Garth Turner.
Vancouver is the BPOE. Full stop.
Read garbage. Spout garbage. GIGO.
I don’t even know what GIGO means, and I refuse to look it up. This had to be said.
As for BPOE. If you need to go around yapping about being the best, you probably aren’t.
I challenge you to refute a single one of Hilliard’s arguments. A single one. Convincingly.
After all, if it’s garbage, this should be easy for you.
Ready, set, go!
Ninja the Toxic Troll – revelling in his ignorance – looking for a pen pal.
Okay, that’s what I thought.
Let it hereby be evidenced, now and for eternity, that Arnie, by his refusal / inability to address a simple question, is completely full of sh*t.
Not that there had ever been a doubt…
I am the Beast.
this is the beast … https://tinyurl.com/yawzsyhy
Something needs to be said:
Uber/Lyft operate in cities throughout North and South America, Europe, Asia, and even Africa.
But in “world class” Vancouver you’ve got good ol’ Yellow Cab.
Give ’em a call, wait 20 minutes.
Cab a no-show? Try MacLure’s.
If that fails, get out on the street and hail one down. Practice your whistling.
Not to worry. Travel the skies in the “Sky” Train.
There’s a rather good book called: Makes Me Wanna Holler, written by someone who did bad, violent things, including gang rape. He broke into a car once and stole some tapes. Listened to them high. One was Pink Floyd. It blew his ghetto mentality. Became a reporter for the Washington Post.
Side note: when I travelled to The far east way back when, I carried only two tapes. One was Jimi Hendrix; the other, Marvin Gaye. Listened to: Makes Me Wanna Holler … so many times.
diversions … fun with floyd .. https://tinyurl.com/y9dmmp88
1480 Howe St. Assessed 2017 @ $181,783,000. Now, with Vancouver House going up on it, it is assessed @ $331,796,000.
Not yet finished, condos are being listed at over $2,000./sq ft. The building has 388 units.
Wonder how this is reflected in statistics.
Underscores the lunacy of talking about “the market” as some monolith. There are so many markets and sub-markets. To talk about the Vancouver market is silly. To talk about the Canadian real estate market is completely idiotic.
It’s like talking about the market for food without distinguishing between dumpster diving and fine dining.
Angry Annie has found the perfect way to resolve his painful cognitive dissonance: Each house is its own “market”. Thus, any price declines seen elsewhere, however widespread or dramatic, are of zero relation to any particular property. A house four walls and a ceiling. Outside them, there is… nothing.
This is the height of willful ignorance. The height of self-deception.
More bile from Ninja the Toxic Troll. Reads rubbish like financial industry toad Shilliard Hilliard Macbeth – and spouts rubbish. More ridiculous than Jessica Barrett, if that’s possible, who had the honesty to admit to loving this great city, but couldn’t make it happen.
Sour grapes Toxic Troll.
Arnie “Room For Milk?” Carnegie struggles with basic financial concepts, but he makes a mean half-caf frapuccino with cinnamon. Don’t forget to throw a few cents in his tip jar.
If you are speaking to a man who uses obscure abbreviations, like “GIGO”, realize that you are not speaking to a man.
Burnaby edition (Note: The condo market there seems to do better than in Vancouver. Why? No Airbnb rules…):
5109 Sussex Avenue, Burnaby
Sep 10: $2,998,000
Change: – 390000.00 -12%
A: $2,874,000 (Flipper burned: bought May 2016 for 3.05 mil$)
1288 Sherlock Avenue, Burnaby
Sep 10: $1,768,000
Change: – 191000.00 -10%
6249 Elgin Avenue, Burnaby
Sep 10: $1,529,000
Change: – 169000.00 -10%
1735 Sherlock Avenue, Burnaby
Sep 10: $1,998,000
Change: – 282000.00 -12%
8245 Burnfield Crescent, Burnaby
Sep 10: $1,398,800
Change: – 148200.00 -10%
Sussex doesn’t look like an attempted flip. The build is just too expensive for this unexceptional location; not south-facing; sloping; terrible walkscore. The land value is only $213./sq ft. It didn’t warrant a custom house with marble floors. It is a stupid build and a stupid purchase, but they got to live in this cold and uninviting enviro for over two years. That would have cost $100K in rent.
Loss on this property is marginal.
Let’s do the math:
Cost of Renting:
Cost of Buying:
Loss of Value = 52,000$ ( If sold at price…. Not going to happen…)
TPP = 67,940$
Realtor fees = ~75,000$ (conservative estimate)
Taxes = ~10,000$ for 2 years (very conservative estimate)
Total = 204,940$
And that’s forgetting 200,000$+ of renos…. And again assuming no mortgage was needed! You call that marginal?
Math is hard.
Sherlock: bought 18 years ago for $639K – looking to cash out. Nice.
Burnfield: bought 10 years ago for $652K. Nice return. Crappy walkscore.
Elgin: nice house – next stop – care home. Not my cuppa, but good value there.
Admit it… My posts live rent-free in your head, don’t they?
What Arnie doesn’t realize is that, after property taxes, insurance, maintenance, and vulture fees, the actual return for these people is in the 5-6% range. And they are extremely lucky in their timing, coinciding as they have with the start and end of one of history’s greatest credit and real estate bubbles. Most will do worse. Some much, much worse. As in losing their shirts.
He also doesn’t realize that a house is not an investment vehicle. It is a consumer item; a place to live; shelter.
If your investment “strategy” is your home, you will in all likelihood be disappointed and, like Arnie, need to work at Starbucks into your 60s, serving overpriced coffee to millennials, praying for tips.
Arnie “Your Latte’s Ready” Carnegie claims Hilliard MacBeth is a shill.
Well, don’t buy his services, if that’s what you think. No one’s holding a gun to your head.
But we need to learn to distinguish between a person and an idea. The alternative leads to discrimination and conflict. Take certain religions, for example. Objectively, some of them are terrible ideas. Just really bad ideas. But should you hate their followers? No.
Again, we need to distinguish between people and ideas.
Forget Hilliard. Listen to the man’s arguments. They are well researched and articulated.
Don’t agree with them? Great. Refute them! Offer something different.
Vancouver second edition:
4863 Osler Street, Vancouver
Sep 13: $3,560,000
Change: – 428000.00 -11%
5537 Chancellor Boulevard, Vancouver
Sep 13: $7,500,000
Change: – 1600000.00 -18%
7882 Fremlin Street, Vancouver
Sep 13: $1,898,000
Change: – 282000.00 -13%
7050 Hudson Street, Vancouver
Sep 12: $5,588,000
Change: – 700000.00 -11%
1849 W 35th Avenue, Vancouver
Sep 12: $5,960,000
Change: – 990000.00 -14%
A: $6,410,000 (Bought in Jun 2015 for 3.2 mil$. That’s impressively good flipping)
6750 Churchill Street, Vancouver
Sep 12: $9,980,000
Change: – 1400000.00 -12%
2639 E 4th Avenue, Vancouver
Sep 12: $1,688,800
Change: – 199200.00 -11%
A: $1,688,900 ( Bought Nov. 2016 @ 1.48 mil$. -150k$ and it’s a burn. )
2195 Sw Marine Drive, Vancouver
Sep 11: $3,580,000
Change: – 400000.00 -10%
A: $3,613,000 (Flipper burned. Bought 3.81 mil$ in June 2016)
67 4900 Cartier Street, Vancouver
Sep 11: $1,488,000
Change: – 411000.00 -22%
2920 E 7th Avenue, Vancouver
Sep 11: $1,199,000
Change: – 199000.00 -14%
A: $1,303,400 (Bought in Jun 2015 for 1 mil$. -100k$ and it’s a burn.)
609 1009 Harwood Street, Vancouver
Sep 11: $699,000
Change: – 150000.00 -18%
In my opinion its unfair and discrimination. There are lot of old residents living in homes for generations that have gained in value, retirees cant even pay property tax now this extra burden is put on them.